Rian Johnson Addresses the Absence of The Knights of Ren in The Last Jedi

After being rumored to appear as a foil for Rey and Luke on Ahch-To, many fans expected to see Kylo Ren’s posse, the Knights of Ren, in The Last Jedi. However, the fabled warriors were nowhere to be found in the movie, and many were left wondering if we would ever see them again (their only appearance so far was in Rey’s Forceback vision in Maz’s castle). In a recent interview with the Empire Podcast, writer/director Rian Johnson explained why he chose not to include the Knights of Ren in the film. Spoilers for The Last Jedi incoming…

 

 

[quotes from the Empire Podcast via MovieWeb]:

 

Johnson’s answer to the conspicuous absence of Kylo Ren’s followers is actually a pretty simple one. Apparently, he felt that the movie was just already too crowded to shoe-horn them in…

“We have a very full movie already there literally was just not room for another element…”

 

 

He also addressed the complications of having them be Snoke’s guards, even though he definitely considered it as an option in the beginning… 

“I guess I could’ve used them in place of the Praetorian guards but then it would feel like wasting them because all those guards had to die. And if Kylo had some kind of connection to them it would’ve added a complication that wouldn’t have helped the scene… truth is I just didn’t see a place for them in the movie.”

 

 

I totally understand Johnson’s reasoning behind this decision, and I am a fan of what he did with the movie overall. However, I have to wonder why he didn’t continue to unravel some of the more obvious threads still dangling from The Force Awakens, specifically concerning the Knights of Ren. It’s clear that he had a specific story in mind and that some of those elements just didn’t fit into his vision. That being said, I hope Abrams is able to give us a satisfying conclusion to the trilogy, bringing his and Rian’s stories together to put that neat little bow on top. But this is no small task to be sure, especially now that the absence of Leia has to be addressed as well.

 

Concept art from The Force Awakens
Concept art from The Force Awakens

 

It will be interesting to see the Knights come into play in a big way in Episode IX, which is entirely possible considering Ren’s new position as Supreme Leader of the First Order and the recent death of his master. Kylo Ren is a considerable opponent on his own, but with the Knights of Ren by his side, he could be nigh unstoppable. Perhaps Abrams will place the death of Leia in the hands of the group as well to give them some added clout and significance in the trilogy’s final chapter. Of course, this is just speculation, but time will tell.

 

What do you think? Will we see the Knights of Ren finally get their big moment on screen in Episode IX?

 

 

+ posts

Jordan Pate is Co-Lead Editor and Senior Writer for Star Wars News Net, of which he is also a member of the book and comic review team. He loves all things Star Wars, but when he's not spending time in the galaxy far far away, he might be found in our own galaxy hanging out in Gotham City or at 1407 Graymalkin Lane, Salem Center, NY.

Jordan Pate (Hard Case)

Jordan Pate is Co-Lead Editor and Senior Writer for Star Wars News Net, of which he is also a member of the book and comic review team. He loves all things Star Wars, but when he's not spending time in the galaxy far far away, he might be found in our own galaxy hanging out in Gotham City or at 1407 Graymalkin Lane, Salem Center, NY.

532 thoughts on “Rian Johnson Addresses the Absence of The Knights of Ren in The Last Jedi

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:04 pm
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    Yeah right, this Canto Bait sequence was so integral to the plot, I can’t imagine switching it for something like Knights of Ren.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:04 pm
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    Yeah right, this Canto Bait sequence was so integral to the plot, I can’t imagine switching it for something like Knights of Ren.

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:05 pm
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      The problem is — Knights of Ren were something fans actually WANTED to see. Rian doesn’t like that.

      • January 18, 2018 at 7:33 pm
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        The problem is that there were a significant amount of pepole who wanted to see Finn and Poe in action. Without the Canto Bight sequence they would have only very little screen time, not to mention their character arcs. Yes the Knigts are interesting and cool, but you can’s sacrafice well established main caracters to some random guys who only had about 7 seconds of screen time.

        I actually wanted to see the KoR but not in exchange of Finns character arc. Hope they will have a significant story in ep IX.

        • January 18, 2018 at 7:55 pm
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          They movie would have worked just fine with Rey/Luke/Snoke/Kylo Ren ‘Force’ part, and then you have Finn/Poe/Leia/Hux Resistance vs First Order part just like it was in the movie.
          RJ actually missed a cool opportunity to have a really good plot of who is going to run the resistance during the movie in the future. You could have had the old guard in Leia and Holdo fighting it out behind the scenes with the new guard Finn/Poe/Rose in a power struggle.

          • January 18, 2018 at 8:00 pm
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            Like the power struggle idea. I thought they were going to go that way when Poe looked disappointed to hear Holdo called instead of him to succeed Leia

          • January 18, 2018 at 8:02 pm
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            I know that they could not foresee Carrie Fisher dying, but that would have been a nice setup for Episode 9 even if they knew she were in the movie. Old guard vs Young guard, and you have the young guard take over the Resistance with Poe running the show with Finn/Rose and even Carrie Fishers real life daughter.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:48 pm
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            And now you realize why Poe acted the way he did and Holdo didnt need his mansplaining.

        • January 18, 2018 at 7:57 pm
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          Ep8 is a lesson in how to screw up a franchise that’s been set up for you to continue. RJ could have done so many great things and decided to throw the balls up in the air, kick them around when they hit the ground, splatter paint on them, rearrange them and some how construct something disguised as a plot. The biggest missed opportunity in film history.

          • January 18, 2018 at 8:12 pm
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            You are 100% right. It was like Rian made this film INTENTIONALLY to spite TFA and to troll the Fans. Every decision is based on screwing over what fans thought would happen — I love a good surprise and all, but making the entire movie non-sense to “fool” the fans was a major mistake.

          • January 18, 2018 at 8:48 pm
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            Except it was written before any fans saw TFA….

        • January 18, 2018 at 8:11 pm
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          Yeah but Finn’s “arc” with Rose was horrid, I’ve seen better Nickelodeon movie arcs.

          • January 18, 2018 at 8:32 pm
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            So that’s where the green slime comes from…

          • January 18, 2018 at 8:32 pm
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            So that’s where the green slime comes from…

        • January 18, 2018 at 8:30 pm
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          Exactly this. I would’ve loved to see the KoR, but not at the expense of screentime for Finn and Poe.

          I suppose the Praetorian Guardians could have been the KoR, BUT fans would have still complained that they had to be killed off so soon in the fight! If you can imagine literally swapping out each of those guards for a Knight of Ren, you’d get 1) no time to familiarize yourself with these guys, 2) no chance of seeing them again in 9. That would’ve only fanned the backlash at TLJ especially considering we just got Snoke nixed. SO that doesn’t work, and given that we now know the KoR to be former students of Luke’s, I think we deserve to see them in a couple more profound scenes in 9.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:35 pm
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            Not to mention fandom would have been totally pissed if KoR were just the Praetorian Guards with different outfits. I can only imagine the uproar.

      • January 18, 2018 at 7:52 pm
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        100% true. There is nothing more annoying then the media and a lot of fans calling out fans like us for wanting some answers from TFA. Yet they were those same one’s who came up with theory after theory for Rey, Snoke, Knights of Ren for the past 2 years, yet now don’t care because Rian Johnson is Spielberg and can do whatever he wants.

        • January 18, 2018 at 8:48 pm
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          You got plenty of answers.

      • January 18, 2018 at 8:40 pm
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        I wanted to see them too, but at the end of the day, there is another film coming, and with Snoke’s guards (and Snoke) out of the way, it leaves an obvious space for a guard unit around Kylo. If JJ doesn’t address them in EpIX then I’ll question the wisdom behind it, but I’m willing to wait for us to start getting location leaks, etc. before forming an opinion.

      • January 18, 2018 at 8:48 pm
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        Baseless.

        • January 18, 2018 at 11:46 pm
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          Rian is / was a very SELFISH writer with The Last Jedi and that is not baseless. His behaviour and contempt in interviews displays this. He’s responsible for one of the worst SW films of all time.

          • January 19, 2018 at 3:50 pm
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            Contempt? Jesus, what plane of reality are you on? Sorry you are butt hurt you didn’t get your fanwank.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:35 pm
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      The Knights of Ren needed to be subverted with a lecture about animal abuse.

    • January 18, 2018 at 9:33 pm
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      Doing what? We already had enough antagonists to deal with. What would another group have done for the film. Save them for 9. Kylo has another group of henchmen that wont need much introduction. Will make the plot move along quicker.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:04 pm
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    Got it Rian — there was room for the ridiculously artificial-looking Preatorian Guards, Falthiers, the entire Canto Bight waste of time, etc — but no time for something the Fan actually WANT to see — the Knights of Ren. What a profound and great Filmmaker you are.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:12 pm
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      Here you go again…speaking for all of fandom.

      • January 18, 2018 at 8:13 pm
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        Judging from all the replies above, I think hella peeps agree with me.

        • January 18, 2018 at 8:47 pm
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          Yeah, lot of people don’t know much about Star Wars.

        • January 18, 2018 at 9:34 pm
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          “hella peeps” isn’t everyone.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:52 pm
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            Considering that TLJ made 40% less than TFA, and is taking a nosedive on Rotten Tomatoes, there a LOT of fans that agree with me. Even more than I expected quite frankly. This film has had a backlash like nothing we have ever seen with SW.

          • January 19, 2018 at 1:40 am
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            And a LOT of fans enjoyed it. So speaking about “the fans” as if they represent some sort of unified front on this movie is inherently faulty. And really, the “hella peeps” you’re probably referring to are the same 15 repetitive bellyachers that endlessly complain about this movie.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:06 pm
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    I have seen so many interviews with Rian Johnson on Social Media defending this or that from the movie, we don’t even need a Directors Commentary at this point!

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:07 pm
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      Today on Rian defends ….

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:54 pm
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      correct me if i’m wrong, but I never remember Irvin Kirshner DEFENDING anything from ESB. The fact that Rian has to defend stuff, shows there’s a lot wrong with TLJ.

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:54 pm
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      correct me if i’m wrong, but I never remember Irvin Kirshner DEFENDING anything from ESB. The fact that Rian has to defend stuff, shows there’s a lot wrong with TLJ.

      • January 18, 2018 at 7:57 pm
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        I get that Director’s have to defend a certain plot point that is ambiguous, but this guy have literally defended EVERY part of the movie in the past month!

        • January 18, 2018 at 8:47 pm
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          It’s called a press tour.

          • January 18, 2018 at 8:59 pm
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            …and a terrible fanbase.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:32 pm
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            That too.

        • January 18, 2018 at 9:28 pm
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          Plot points Lucas and Kirshner would have had to defend/discuss.

          What is the deal with the cave.
          Luke’s father being Vader and how can you end the movie with the truth not being known.
          How can you end the movie without knowing the fate of Han Solo.
          Whats the deal with Leia hearing Luke.
          How could Luke fall down that huge chasm and survive.
          Why if the rebels have these awesome ION cannons why dont they use them all the time.
          Giant space worm living in an Asteroid? Really how often does some fly into it so it gets fed?

      • January 18, 2018 at 8:47 pm
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        He isn’t defending. He is discussing and answering questions.

        I don’t recall an Intenet in 198 but maybe you live in a different reality than I do.

      • January 18, 2018 at 9:23 pm
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        You have got to be kidding me. We are lucky there wasnt an internet at the time. ESB caused huge controversy. First sequels were something that notoriously failed prior to Godfather 2 and ESB. Second a movie ending on multiple cliffhangers. Remember sequels and trilogies were uncommon. Some even doubted that Lucas would be able to make all 3 if ESB wasnt moderately successful.

      • January 20, 2018 at 3:08 am
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        This is because back in 1980 there wasn’t this juggernaut of a geek-content industry and online ‘journalism’ didn’t exist. Interviewers might have asked the director of the film questions about, you know, the direction of the film, rather than try and solve inane in-universe plot points that fanboys obsess over.

        People literally ask Rian Johnson about Adam Driver’s shirtless scene when given the chance to pick his brain.

        It’s the quality of the criticism that sucks, not Johnson’s answers, which are usually pretty thoughtful, even if you disagree with his ideas and don’t like his film.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:11 pm
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      Johnson isn’t defending anything. He’s talking about the movie he made. Directors and producers do that. A lot.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:06 pm
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    “Oh, those mysterious guys in the flashback? I forgot all about them until now”!

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:06 pm
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    No place for the Kinghts of Ren, but enough place for Holdo and Canto BITES!

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:26 pm
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      Plenty of time for Rose.

      • January 18, 2018 at 8:46 pm
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        Because that’s story he wanted to tell. Jesus, embarrassing to read Star Wars fans know nothing about creating stories.

        • January 18, 2018 at 11:56 pm
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          We do know about creating stories, we like GOOD stories, not stories that waste time around straight-from-Nickelodeon-characters like Rose.

        • January 18, 2018 at 11:56 pm
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          We do know about creating stories, we like GOOD stories, not stories that waste time around straight-from-Nickelodeon-characters like Rose.

          • January 19, 2018 at 3:49 pm
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            You just proved my point if you think that haha.

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:32 pm
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      had plenty of time to give rose a backstory but no one else .lol

      • January 18, 2018 at 8:46 pm
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        Yeah, that whole monologue that lasted less than a minute really cut into the Knights of Ren time.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:45 pm
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      Yeah, subplots.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:58 pm
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      You’ll note that, other than in a minute part of a flashback, there was no room for the Knights of Ren in EpVII either. I’d guess they’re still around as otherwise there’d be no point to Snoke calling Kylo their master, but they’re obviously off doing other things – most likely trying to track down Luke, seeing as EpVIII makes it clear they were all ex-students.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:58 pm
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      You’ll note that, other than in a minute part of a flashback, there was no room for the Knights of Ren in EpVII either. I’d guess they’re still around as otherwise there’d be no point to Snoke calling Kylo their master, but they’re obviously off doing other things – most likely trying to track down Luke, seeing as EpVIII makes it clear they were all ex-students.

      • January 18, 2018 at 9:22 pm
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        I’m sure they’ll tell their story in a novel or comic.

        Shame all the real potential is kept for for the side media.

        • January 18, 2018 at 9:24 pm
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          It is, but as I said in another post, we still have EpIX, and with Snoke and the Praetorian Guards out of the way, it does create a natural situation for Kylo to surround himself with his Knights.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:08 pm
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    Kind of tired of reading “Rian addresses.” I’d like to move past this movie now. Let’s get the Solo hype train going. Give me a trailer… something!

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:31 pm
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      yeah can we get a trailer for solo already .lol

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:59 pm
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      It would be interesting if Disney never released a Trailer for Solo, and the movie just came out in May. What box office would it do the first weekend?

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:33 pm
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      The Rian Johnson Explanation Tour will continue for the forseeable future.

      • January 18, 2018 at 9:20 pm
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        Luckily the Internet was around when ESB came out. Then Lucas and Kershner would have had to have an Explanation Tour.

        • January 18, 2018 at 9:26 pm
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          Not likely. Folks were generally pleased with TESB. I was around at the time, but for folks who weren’t, you can read the Starlog magazines of the time to get a sense of the general feel for the movie at the time. The magazine always showcased letters from readers.

          The notion that people didn’t like TESB, is mostly revisionsim coming from people who want to bring the OT down to the level of ST so that they’re both equal, which of course they’re not.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:45 pm
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            I was around at the time. I am 51 and since the Saturday in June 1977 when I spent the whole day in the theater watching Star Wars over and over and over I have been a fan. I remember the controversy and subscribed to Starlog. Which by the way amazing didnt pay nearly as much attention to Star Wars preferring Star Trek. Letters to the editor isnt the same thing as open internet by the way. ESB controversy came directly from critics.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:45 pm
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            I was around at the time. I am 51 and since the Saturday in June 1977 when I spent the whole day in the theater watching Star Wars over and over and over I have been a fan. I remember the controversy and subscribed to Starlog. Which by the way amazing didnt pay nearly as much attention to Star Wars preferring Star Trek. Letters to the editor isnt the same thing as open internet by the way. ESB controversy came directly from critics.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:49 pm
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            Then you ought to be familiar with the multitude of magazines and fanzines of the period which also published similar material.

            Just because there wasn’t an internet, didn’t mean we all lived in a cave. We still had numerous forms of communication. The primary difference was that unhinged personalities found it difficult to get a hearing, whereas now its much easier for them to make their voices heard.

            There’s a reason that ESB has been considered the best Star Wars film for decades, up until the point in time just recently when it needed to be tore down in a failed attempt to elevate these new Disney films.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:59 pm
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            ESB became known as the best after an initial luke warm introduction. Critics even redid reviews.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:04 pm
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            That’s really just not the case. It wasn’t a scenario like Blade Runner when everyone panned the film and it only became a hit later when it found an audience on home vide. It wasn’t even a case like Return of the Jedi which received heavy criticism for the Ewoks. What your recounting here is pure revisionism.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:04 pm
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            From “The Secret history of Star Wars”

            “Tomatometer Scores for Original Trilogy During Original Release Dates:

            *31% – Return of the Jedi

            *52% – The Empire Strikes Back

            *79% – Star Wars

            *Average Tomatometer: 54%

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:19 pm
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            There was no Tomatometer in 1980.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:21 pm
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            I know that this is from looking up the reviews from 1980 and using the same methods. RottenTomatoes used to have this on their site.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:23 pm
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            Well, except there’s no way to be certain that all the reviews from 1980 were found.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:26 pm
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            RottenTomatoes found enough of them. It is true that now there are far more critics. Back then it was newspapers and magazines and a few TV shows. We had this stuff called Microfiche that we could scan through. As a Star Wars geek since 1977. I remember scanning through microfiche at the public library and looking through card catalogs looking for Star Wars material. It could be found.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:36 pm
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            Enough? How do we know?

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:46 pm
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            Oh search yourself. You can find discussions and screen shots of old reviews. This isnt something that has never been discussed before. For most it is pretty common knowledge that ESB was no critically accepted when it first came out as ANH. Not even close.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:55 pm
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            You’re missing the point here. Much of what was published back then is simply lost, not everything was scanned. So there’s really no way of knowing if RT has indeed scanned enough articles to make a reasonably factual statistic.

            I would argue the opposite, that it was “pretty common knowledge” that ESB was a generally well perceived film, often referred to as the greatest sequel ever made, and has been since up until the recent point that it needed to be tore down in order to bring the ST up.

            But the primary problem with all of these arguments, both yours and mine, is that none of them actually matter.

            At the end of the day, people can watch the DVDs or the streams, and see the films themselves. In the end, all that really matters is what is actually on screen. So these efforts to try to equalize the ST with the OT with argumentation are doomed to inevitable failure.

          • January 18, 2018 at 11:31 pm
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            All the major newspapers and magazines were scanned and put on microfiche. Hell even small towns newspapers were scanned and put on microfiche. Lets not act like history from the 80s was lost. Well perceived and considered the masterpiece and best Star Wars film is not the same thing. Surprise for you TLJ is very well perceived. Hate to break it to you. And I suspect over time especially when this trilogy is all wrapped up with a nice pretty bow will be even better perceived just as ESB was after ROTJ.

          • January 18, 2018 at 11:36 pm
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            No, not all the major newspapers and magazines were scanned and put onto microfiche. Many escaped that process.

            History not just from the 80s, but from every era is lost to some extent.

            No. TLJ is not well perceived by people who can see beyond the Star Wars logo, and who have no regard for unthinking social justice politics.

            Heh, you know, I can remember back when Episode I was released, folks saying that we have to wait for Episode II and II to come out before we could really understand it. That somehow, Episode II and III would make I better. Tell me how you think that turned out.

            But again, all of this is entirely irrelevant.

            People can see what’s on the screen for themselves. So all arguments attempting to equalize OT with ST, including this one, are doomed to inevitable failure. And it’s this reality that is causing you now become agitated, isn’t it?

          • January 19, 2018 at 1:33 am
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            You can find enough to generate a good answer.
            TLJ came out and it was 93% pretty much after the embargo with 30 reviews, and then 92% a week later with 220 reviews

          • January 19, 2018 at 1:34 am
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            You don’t know if you’re finding enough to generate a good answer. That’s the point.

            But again, none of this means anything.

            All that matters, is what is actually on screen.

          • January 19, 2018 at 1:30 am
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            Do you have a link to this

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:23 pm
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            Blade Runner wasnt the sequel to the most successful film of all time. ESB was going to do well at least initially no matter what critical reaction was. Blade Runner not so much.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:38 pm
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            That’s not really the point. Although, what Blade Runner was, is a film that ideally should have done well in what was considered a genre reborn since the release of Star Wars.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:51 pm
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            And incidentally, there actually was an internet all through the 80s. It was primarily bulletin boards, and usually accessible only to computer gurus, but it was there. Remember the old modem with the giant black rubber suction cups that you’d insert the old phone receiver into?

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:58 pm
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            Yes and not nearly the same thing as the Internet of today.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:00 pm
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            Right, it was much more difficult for unhinged cranks to express their views back then.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:57 pm
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            I agree as there is this revisionist history that ESB was just as divisive as TLJ, so that will make TLJ beloved in a few years.

            Here’s the difference: ESB was beloved by the diehards who eventually turned out to be lifelong fans like me. The casual fans like my older brother didn’t like ESB and never cared about SW after that.

            TLJ is despised by the diehard fans who felt Luke and TFA plot points were handled clumsily. The casual fans like TLJ cause they’ve not as invested in Luke and mythology of the Saga.

            So the casual fans will move onto the next blockbuster while the diehards will always hate the movie.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:45 pm
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      Then don’t click the article?

      I enjoy reading a filmmaker discuss his work.

      • January 18, 2018 at 10:09 pm
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        I think my comment summed it up nicely. It’s the headline. We’ve seen it quite often. I’m hoping for a new focus on Solo. Sooner than later.

        • January 18, 2018 at 10:16 pm
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          I think my point stands, haha.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:45 pm
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            My point is the pointiest!

      • January 18, 2018 at 10:24 pm
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        You don’t like his comment? Then take your own advice and zip it.

        People enjoy expressing themselves.

    • January 18, 2018 at 10:15 pm
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      Considering that this site’s creators know the passionate reactions these Rian-splaing articles evoke, I’d say they’re secretly rooting for our vocal band of rebels while still outwardly maintaining a degree of neutral professionalism. At least that’s what I’d like to believe.

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:51 am
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        You rebel scum!!!

      • January 19, 2018 at 1:42 am
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        “…secretly rooting for our vocal band of rebels …”

        Secretly rooting for them to do what?

        • January 19, 2018 at 1:57 am
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          First rule of Secret Star Wars Society– don’t talk about Secret Star Wars Society

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:12 pm
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    He had to cut them to make way for Porgs, the failure macguffin and cranky Luke.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:13 pm
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    I assume the Knights of Ren are out locking down the galaxy for the First Order. Kylo, Snoke and Hux can’t be everywhere. It would be cool to see them in IX but they are not essential. On cue, here comes the whining from people that don’t understand how Rey’s boots stay on because they didn’t see her tie her laces.

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:21 pm
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      yeah why bother having your crack team hunting down the last group of rebels in the galaxy or a jedi master in hiding when you can keep them off screen doing busy work.

      • January 18, 2018 at 7:45 pm
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        Exactly. Why would you put your crack team on the trail of a small band of Rebels when there’s a fleet of Star Destroyers on their trail already. How do you know they’re not looking for Luke? The First Order still doesn’t know where he’s hiding in TLJ.

        • January 18, 2018 at 7:47 pm
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          how do i know they weren’t looking for luke? because the movie doesn’t tell me that. we aren’t mind readers, they have to give us some basic plot details.

          • January 18, 2018 at 7:52 pm
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            Looking for Luke makes sense but it does need to be explained. There’s been alot of after-the-fact storytelling in this trilogy. I want to see this stuff on screen

          • January 18, 2018 at 8:32 pm
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            Yes, movies allow you to fill in details when those details are not essential to the plot. During the entire movie were you thinking to yourself that none of this makes sense without the whereabouts of extremely minor background characters that had three seconds of screen time? I promise you, it was not important to the plot.

          • January 18, 2018 at 8:45 pm
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            How I pine for the days when movie-goers could think for themselves.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:10 pm
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            Considering they “subverted” all the detail filling fans did in the first film, why even bother? Also, I didn’t say it was important to the plot, I said if they want me to think something they need to give some sort of indication. It’s a movie, not a magic eye painting.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:39 pm
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            That would be telling you what to think but whatever. Some people have a hard time focusing on what’s important and also lack imagination.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:47 pm
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            One movie makes me think it’s important, the next drops it completely. What am I supposed think now? And again, its not my job to tell their story yet I’m supposed to used my imagination? Is this real life?

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:09 pm
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            They didn’t make you think it was important. You convinced yourself of that. You might as well ask why we didn’t learn more about Kanjiklub. These dudes had way more screen time than The Knights of Ren. Where’s Kanjiklub? Did Kanjiklub survive? Don’t Kanjuiklub want payment for Chewy now? Kaaaaaannnnnjiiiiiklllluuuubbbbb!!!!!

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:17 pm
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            Youre right, why should I think a group of badasses led by the main villain and featured prominently in the Rey’s vision be important? Silly me.
            Also, now I’m not supposed to fill in the gaps again? This is so confusing. Is there a chart somewhere that explains what I am and what I’m not supposed to make up myself? Thx.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:40 pm
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            You’re completely blowing out of proportion their role in TFA to make your point. You can fill in whatever gap you want or you can not fill it in. Nothing concerning The Knights of Ren will make a bit of difference to the story that’s being told. If you’re confused there’s nothing anyone can do for you. These are not complicated movies.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:53 pm
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            Im confused not by the films but by the silly rules you people put on viewing and discussing them. Plot point doesn’t make sense, that’s your fault. Information missing, your fault. No characterization, also your fault. Any problem a person has with the film is their fault now. It’s like trying to talk to a Scientologist.

          • January 19, 2018 at 2:19 pm
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            Sounds like you need to be audited. I’m sure one of this forum’s know-it-all elites would be happy to lend you their Star Wars electropsychometer.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:43 pm
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            What did they subvert?

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:18 pm
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            So having a through away line from say Snoke saying “Now that I know where Luke is the Knights of Ren can take him out” would have made the movie better?

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:20 pm
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            Again, if they want me to know something about what characters are doing they need to tell me.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:42 pm
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            OK so maybe you didnt need to know. That is what I meant by throw away line.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:50 pm
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            Exactly you didnt need to know for the development of the movie and the characters. They are a convenient plot device for Ep9 without a totally knew introduction. We have got some basic information about them already.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:54 pm
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            That’s fine, but not the premise of this thread. Mr George said: how do you not know they weren’t looking for Luke? And I said: I can’t know unless they tell me. Then several redundant replies later here we are.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:58 pm
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            It was established in TFA that The First Order is looking for Luke. Snoke reinforces that in TLJ with forcing the information out of Rey.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:02 pm
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            None of that has to do with the knights of Ren. At all. I’m sure they’ll retcon it later in a book though.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:10 pm
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      “…here comes the whining from people that don’t understand how Rey’s boots stay on because they didn’t see her tie her laces.”

      Ha! This is brilliant and pretty much sums up how a lot of folks watch movies.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:13 pm
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    I understand why RJ didn’t use the KOR, but they needed to be addressed in some fashion. For yeah; I liked TLJ, but RJ needed to better honor JJ Abrams setup. I may not like that setup, but I know plenty of people who did. And really, if RJ didn’t want to use the Knights of Ren; I had one simple explaination to which would have solved this.

    Just say that the Knights of Ren where operating in the Outter Rim. And heck, that could have been great as it would have explained A) how the FO took over so quickly and B) why the Resistance’s allies didn’t show up.

    Because, they were busy fighting the Knights of Ren. Overall, this is just my take so really don’t get angry at me.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:15 pm
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    i disagree wholeheartedly on this. kylo having to fight and kill his former mates(along with his master) for rey instead a group of faceless guards we know nothing about would have had far more emotional impact. but then again what do i know…

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:18 pm
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      Indeed. Personally, my hope was that had Ben turned to the light side Episode Nine would have seen him and Rey fighting the KOR as a way to atone for his sins.

      I would have been fine with the KOR absence had we gotten an explaination. For instance, just explain they were operating in the Outter Rim. Heck, tie the Resistance’s reinforcements and say they were busy fighting them.

      That would have made sense, because logically we know that the FO was currently expanding to take control and the KOR are their best bet given they are loyal to to Kylo. And especially now given he’s the new Supreme leader.

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:18 pm
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      Indeed. Personally, my hope was that had Ben turned to the light side Episode Nine would have seen him and Rey fighting the KOR as a way to atone for his sins.

      I would have been fine with the KOR absence had we gotten an explaination. For instance, just explain they were operating in the Outter Rim. Heck, tie the Resistance’s reinforcements and say they were busy fighting them.

      That would have made sense, because logically we know that the FO was currently expanding to take control and the KOR are their best bet given they are loyal to to Kylo. And especially now given he’s the new Supreme leader.

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:18 pm
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      You must intensify your subversion! Otherwise expectations will be met!

      On a more serious note. The Guards seemed fairly talented. Especially fighting Force users. Wonder if they were Force sensitive?

      • January 18, 2018 at 7:22 pm
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        i sure we’ll get four books and a comic series explaining where they came from.

        • January 18, 2018 at 7:39 pm
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          Which in of itself is a problem as that is basically patchwork storytelling/ DLC.

          • January 18, 2018 at 7:44 pm
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            exactly. why bother with characterization in the films when you can chuck it all into books.

          • January 18, 2018 at 8:10 pm
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            To be fair, the entire Clone Wars animated series was patchwork storytelling, yet look how beloved that turned out. George wasn’t able to tell the whole story of the Clone Wars or explore the “brotherhood” between Obi-Wan and Anakin in just the movies, since he crammed so much into them already.

          • January 18, 2018 at 8:52 pm
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            And that is a valid point and something I actually do consider when saying those words. It is why it confuses me why LF under the Disney banner didn’t really consider this byproduct.

      • January 18, 2018 at 7:31 pm
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        That’s the one thing I will give TLJ credit: The royal guards weren’t useless over glorified fighters. ROTJ they were. Here, at least they put up a fight. Could they have been better? Sure. But yeah, credit is where credit is due. As that fight sequence was amazing.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:44 pm
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      Except the Knights might be people more loyal to him and he wouldn’t kill them. It would be a waste of a concept.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:25 pm
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    We’d better see them in IX.

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:27 pm
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      I would like to see JJ better connect the films. Blows me away they cut that Dice scene from TFA. Only to have Rian put such a focus on it. Basically weird choices on everyone’s part there.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:26 pm
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    I’m sure Abrams will have them in IX. It’s his film that introduced them.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:30 pm
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    ryan hasn’t explained the absence of starwars in episode 8 .lol

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:46 pm
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      Wow aren’t you so clever

      • January 18, 2018 at 8:52 pm
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        oh did someone get there feelings hurt ,its just a joke ,dont have to be a such a sensitive lil girl .lol

        • January 18, 2018 at 9:18 pm
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          So you’re saying only girls are sensitive and implying that it’s a detrimental character flaw that makes you weak? I mean you must, as you used it as an insult. I’m sorry you hate women so much. Maybe it’s repressed feelings about inner self hate? Maybe you need a hug?

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:52 pm
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            How’s your white horse doing?

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:59 pm
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            How’s your crass generalization that only men visit this website doing?

          • January 19, 2018 at 12:16 am
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            Where or how did I assume your gender? But of course, to the SJW (male, female, fluid, etc) everything is offensive

        • January 18, 2018 at 11:30 pm
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          Yes, I really poured my heart into that response and was quite obviously, deeply offended by your comment. Somebody get me a puppy.

          From baseless to misogynist. What’s next?

    • January 18, 2018 at 11:56 pm
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      That Was AMAZING! It didn’t feel like Star Wars, feels more like a Marvel Flick or an Anime.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:34 pm
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    I know right? They shouldn’t have had Vader in Empire Strikes Back. That way the movie would have had more breathing room.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:34 pm
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    I know right? They shouldn’t have had Vader in Empire Strikes Back. That way the movie would have had more breathing room.

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:42 pm
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      Vader is a main character. The Knights of Ren don’t even have as much screen time as the alien that tips of the Stormtroopers about what hanger the Falcon is in in ANH.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:34 pm
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    Eh. I didn’t care where they were in TLJ; just like I didn’t care where they were in TFA. TLJ takes place immediately after TFA, so wherever they were during the events of that movie is probably the same for TLJ. Now that some time will most likely pass between TLJ and 9 I’m sure JJ can bring them in.

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:45 pm
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      I hope they don’t waste much storytelling time on explaining where they’ve been. Need to move the story forward. Simply saying they were off looking for Luke should cover it.

      How about a two-for…open IX with one or two of these knights on a raid to take out rebel leadership. They get to Leia (canned footage), she turns and cut to her memorial. Now to the new stuff…

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:39 pm
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    I think that scene in the rain from TFA seems like it is something to still happen. I do think we will see them in Episode 9 and those students you see that are dead there, aren’t Luke’s they are actually Rey’s.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:18 pm
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      OH SH**. That would be a pretty incredible twist. Although, I doubt it’ll happen, as this is the final installment, where loose ends are to be tied up, not unraveled even further.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:45 pm
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      Good thinking.

    • January 19, 2018 at 2:33 am
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      I assumed the KOR were dead during TFA since they never actually appeared in the present tense, but this could be a cool idea too.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:40 pm
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    Further backing the view that Rian just made whatever movie he wanted to rather than giving any thought as to what came before. I personally think the way it went down, to have them instead of the Praetorian Guards (or them having become the Praetorian Gaurds) would have fit, seeing as Kylo is killing everything from his past, they could have just been another element of his past he’s discarded to move forward, especially if they’d shown more loyalty to Snoke than to him.

    Really makes me wonder, if Kasdan hadn’t been the one to voice concerns about Solo whether we would have had a director change, seeing as Disney were happy to let Rian alter the trajectory and tone of the sequel trilogy, how much further removed could the Lego guys have taken it?

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:41 pm
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    He has no logic for anything he did, or did not do in this horribly written (yet visually awesome) movie.

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:56 pm
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      Funny, it sounds like he had his reasons, along with his LF team of collaborators, for everything he did.

      • January 18, 2018 at 8:32 pm
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        Yes. Poor reasons.

        • January 18, 2018 at 11:16 pm
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          So you have said

          • January 18, 2018 at 11:18 pm
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            Yes. I have.

          • January 18, 2018 at 11:18 pm
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            Yes. I have.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:05 pm
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      That’s not true.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:31 pm
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      I keep hearing people describe the film as visucally awesome, but frankly, I feel visually it was retreading old ground.

      The designs we saw were 40 year old Ralph McQuarrie rejects. There really wasn’t anything new here, or stunning. It was all very paint by numbers.

      • January 18, 2018 at 9:14 pm
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        Give us an example. Actually I think fandom has held back designs more then anything. People so hung up on X-Wings vs Tie Fighters. I hope that Ep9 goes more the route of ROTJ and starts adding other sorts of ships.

      • January 18, 2018 at 9:14 pm
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        Give us an example. Actually I think fandom has held back designs more then anything. People so hung up on X-Wings vs Tie Fighters. I hope that Ep9 goes more the route of ROTJ and starts adding other sorts of ships.

        • January 18, 2018 at 9:17 pm
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          Well, for example, the ships consisted of X-Wings and TIE Fighters and Star Destroyers. These are things we’ve all seen before. Many times. There are some slight modifications and repaintings here and there, and in some cases they’re using old Ralph McQuarrie designs which were rejected from the OT production, but everything we’re seeing is very re-runish.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:40 pm
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            So you are talking about TFA. So I agree that TFA should have introduced more new designs. Since TLJ took place directly after TFA we werent going to see the Resistance have much new that we didnt see in already. We saw that they still had A-Wings and the new Bombers and a couple of capital ships that were similar but different. We did see that the First Order had 2 new capital ships.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:44 pm
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            Well, compare and contrast this with IV and V in the OT.

            So when V was released, we saw walkers. They’re old hat now, but they were brand new and not seen in IV. We saw snow speeders. Also new. We saw the rebel fleet, including the medical ship. New. Everything in Cloud City was brand new. The TIE Bombers were a new addition. The Super Star Destroyer was brand new. The Wampa and Taun-Tauns were new. Yoda and Dagobah were new.

            But with the ST, everyting is derivative. It’s all old hat, things we have all seen before, with only slight modifications.

            Except for the Crystal Foxes, those were pretty neat.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:54 pm
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            Multiple years passed between IV and V. TFA to TLJ was maybe weeks. You werent going to see much more especially with the Resistance. TFA had them get back to the base and then in TLJ a short time later they are fleeing.

            So what chances were to see new things. New capital ships of The First Order that hang around with Snoke. Ships of Canto Bight. Evolved AT-ATs and abandoned ships on Crait.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:58 pm
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            I’m not sure that the time passed between films is pertinant here. Sure we didn’t see AT-ATs in IV, but that doesn’t necessarily mean they weren’t around, just that they didn’t appear in a segment of the story. After all, they make an appearance in Rogue One which is set before IV.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:58 pm
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            I’m not sure that the time passed between films is pertinant here. Sure we didn’t see AT-ATs in IV, but that doesn’t necessarily mean they weren’t around, just that they didn’t appear in a segment of the story. After all, they make an appearance in Rogue One which is set before IV.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:10 pm
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            The point is you had no logical reason why what you saw the Resistance had in TFA to TLJ would be much different. I really want to see more in Ep9. Honestly with time passing and the remains having to recruit help they better have new designs in Ep9.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:17 pm
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            Right, but that point doesn’t hold water. The reason that we saw AT-ATs in V wasn’t beause time had passed and the Empire developed something new, it’s because we hadn’t seen a battle before that would require the use of AT-ATs and now we did. So there’s no reason at all not to design something new for TLJ, unless the imagination just isn’t there, and I argue that it isn’t.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:17 pm
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            Right, but that point doesn’t hold water. The reason that we saw AT-ATs in V wasn’t beause time had passed and the Empire developed something new, it’s because we hadn’t seen a battle before that would require the use of AT-ATs and now we did. So there’s no reason at all not to design something new for TLJ, unless the imagination just isn’t there, and I argue that it isn’t.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:41 pm
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            You brought up the reason to see AT-ATs in ESB. So what is the reason to see say more fighters in TLJ? If anything since we saw A-Wings in TLJ why didnt we see them in TFA? They were good enough to attack the Death Star in ROTJ. Why werent they used to attack Star Killer base. We saw the bombers in TLJ because they would have been useless at StarKiller base.

            You didnt have time to see say an even more improved X-Wing. You didnt have time to see new Tie derivatives other then Kylo’s. Now with time passing and rebellion recruiting new people we better see new designs in Ep9.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:44 pm
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            The reason to see more fighters in TLJ, as always is creativity and imagination. Your argument is that there wasn’t any new battle or environment for new craft to be in. I’m saying that that’s exactly what the problem is. There should also be new environments and scenarios.

          • January 18, 2018 at 11:24 pm
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            The reason for the new environments is for the story not to show new designs. The story took place immediately after TFA. If during the escape from the resistance base showed us all these additional fighters leaving wouldnt you have been saying “Where were they in TFA?”. I would have. I would have said why werent they used before. It just doesnt make logical sense for all these ships that were never seen before just show up with no time for them to arrive.

          • January 18, 2018 at 11:28 pm
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            So were you asking where all the AT-ATs were in ANH?

          • January 19, 2018 at 3:26 pm
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            No I have been over this with you already. There was no point in seeing them in ANH. Did the Empire have a ground assault anywhere? The only time that the Empire had troops on the ground in ANH was searching for droids on Tatooine. We didnt see AT-ACTs in ESB because the Empire wasnt moving any transport. We are talking continuity. You seem to believe that the Resistance should have had all these additional types of fighter craft right after the end of TFA. It like you go into a car showroom to shop then walk out to take a test drive then come back in and all the cars in the showroom have changed. The Resistance base didnt have all sorts of new ships at the end of TFA. They shouldnt all of a sudden have them at the beginning of TLJ.

          • January 18, 2018 at 11:44 pm
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            Did you wonder where the A-Wing and B-Wing fighters from ROTJ were in ANH? Where the TIE Interceptors were? Or the Imperial Shuttles?

          • January 19, 2018 at 1:40 am
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            Huh. You are going backwards in time. ANH came before ROTJ. Lets look at Rogue One did you see A-Wings and B-Wings? If you had then they were gone in ANH that would be wrong. So it is consistent. Rogue One showed craft meant for landing troops (U-Wing). It makes sense that you wouldnt see the U-Wing in ANH because they had no need for a troop transport.

            The Rebellion fleet was all together in ROTJ so the A-Wings and B-Wings being in ROTJ but not ANH makes sense. Time went by and the rebellion grew.

          • January 19, 2018 at 1:44 am
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            Hmmmm.

          • January 19, 2018 at 1:44 am
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            Hmmmm.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:47 pm
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    it was certainly a full movie.

    Problem is as much as I like Canto Bight it had no real pay-off. I also don’t like how Poe has a lot of Resistance blood on his hands for pushing his own agenda and it appears to be looked over. If Poe hadn’t of mistrusted high command then the escape plan to shuttle to Crait would of worked and the FO would of sailed past.

    • January 18, 2018 at 7:49 pm
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      Well if he didn’t destroy that dreadnought at the beginning of the movie they would have been destroyed well before that.

      • January 18, 2018 at 8:30 pm
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        If only the Lucasfilm Story Group understood that.

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:55 am
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        I thought Leia wanted to jump to hyperspace sooner?

        • January 19, 2018 at 2:43 pm
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          She did. She didn’t know that they would be tracked and followed through hyperspace at that point, so it makes sense she’d try to get as many people out as possible. Poe’s mission seemed to be to just keep the First Order forces occupied long enough to do so.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:03 pm
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      I thought it was mostly Finn and Rose’s fault that there were so many dead Resistance? They trusted DJ, then DJ sold them out, leading Hux to pick off the transports as they were going to Crait. Poe rebelled against Holdo, sure, but it wasn’t at the cost of any more lives.

      • January 18, 2018 at 8:29 pm
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        TLJ is the story about two days worth of failed missions which started when the women in charge forgot to fill up the gas tank before they left home.

        • January 18, 2018 at 8:36 pm
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          Wow. Ladies and gentlemen, I found the misogynist.

          • January 18, 2018 at 8:48 pm
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            And I in turn have just found someone who doesn’t understand the definition of the word misogynist. Wow indeed.

          • January 18, 2018 at 11:20 pm
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            How so?

            This is actually an astute point. He is pointing out that the big moral lesson of the Crait battle scene, expressed by Rose, is undermined by the actions of another character, Holdo. Holdo showed that what Rose said to Finn was utter tripe… to save the ones she loved, she had to kill a bunch of people she hated (or intensely disliked, or whatever) and herself.

            Finn faced an almost identical dilemma as Holdo, but Rose stopped him.

            Anyhow, name-calling is easier than addressing arguments.

      • January 18, 2018 at 8:42 pm
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        Poe sent them on their mission.

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:54 am
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        Wasn’t it Poe whom updated Finn and Rose of the plan to move to Crait? Can’t recall if DJ was in the background, or was simply told by Finn. Still it was information that shouldn’t of been passed on.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:27 pm
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      It was a full movie, but the things it was filled with were just lame.

    • January 18, 2018 at 9:11 pm
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      Actually I dont agree. The cruiser was on fumes at the time. Travelling at sub light speed it wouldnt have gotten far past Crait. FO likely boards the Cruiser rather then blowing it up. Not to mention Kylo wouldnt sense his mothers presence on the Cruiser. So they double back. Without the explosion caused by the Cruiser hyperspace through the Supremacy Rey doesnt escape in the commotion. So no one get to Crait to carry off the survivors.

      • January 19, 2018 at 1:01 am
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        I’m pretty sure Hux was ready to blow the Cruiser up, but aside from that get your point.

    • January 18, 2018 at 9:23 pm
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      Canto Bight was a pivotal moment for Finn. The moment he stopped running and started fighting for a cause. Up to this point he hadn’t identified himself as First Order or Resistance. From the moment we see him in TFA he is running. He is running on Starkiller Base, he is running on Takodana. In TLJ his first action is to run. He had no loyalty to the resistance.

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:59 am
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        Totally agree in regard to Finn. Its the overall payoff besides character development, the whole mission is debunked and becomes pointless.

  • January 18, 2018 at 7:50 pm
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    did Kylo have his mask in the Knights of ren scene. Now he’s smashed it up. So good luck to JJ for sorting out continuity. And as for crowed movie, the KOR coud easily have gone in to this movie. There was so much you could cut out, mostly Finn and Rose. Finn’s character is practically obsolete at this stage, he serves absolutely no purpose.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:05 pm
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      I agree they could have gone in…even if they were only mentioned in the crawl like: “Supreme Leader Snoke now deploys his merciless legions to seize military control of the galaxy, while the Knights of Ren relentlessly search for the whereabouts of the Last Jedi”. There, problem solved.

      What continuity error is created by the loss of Ren helm?

      • January 19, 2018 at 2:53 pm
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        Just making that addition to the opening crawl would have created another point for people to complain about though. Why mention them searching for Luke and not have them show up when he’s actually within the First Order’s grasp?

        I could suggest something like this instead: “Supreme Leader Snoke now deploys the Knights of Ren and his merciless legions to seize military control of the galaxy ..”

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:42 pm
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      That was a flashback?

      if you think Finn served no purpose, you weren’t watching.

      • January 18, 2018 at 10:15 pm
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        Finn should have died a Hero & took out that cannon.

        • January 18, 2018 at 10:16 pm
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          That would be missing the point from earlier, but sure.

    • January 18, 2018 at 9:08 pm
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      He can always go back to wearing the mask. Can simply be now that he got Snoke out of the way he can be who he wants to be.

      • January 18, 2018 at 10:13 pm
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        Kylo now Leader could spite Snoke & make a new Mask.

  • January 18, 2018 at 8:05 pm
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    “It’s clear that he had a specific story in mind and that some of those elements just didn’t fit into his vision.”

    What’s also clear is there is no overarching story arc for this trilogy. You can’t take three people (now two, since Abrams is doing the bookends) who want to tell their own “specific” stories and dispense arbitrarily with “elements” they deem expendable, then bundle them together and call it a trilogy in any meaningful sense of the term.

    After TFA, even if there was no plan, a decent storyline continuing through the next two movies could have been cobbled together.

    Now, after TLJ, it is almost inconceivable a satisfying conclusion can be made. Not in two hours. Episode IX might be a great movie (we can hope) but I don’t see how it can be a great movie AND make these movies feel like parts of a unified whole.

  • January 18, 2018 at 8:05 pm
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    “It’s clear that he had a specific story in mind and that some of those elements just didn’t fit into his vision.”

    What’s also clear is there is no overarching story arc for this trilogy. You can’t take three people (now two, since Abrams is doing the bookends) who want to tell their own “specific” stories and dispense arbitrarily with “elements” they deem expendable, then bundle them together and call it a trilogy in any meaningful sense of the term.

    After TFA, even if there was no plan, a decent storyline continuing through the next two movies could have been cobbled together.

    Now, after TLJ, it is almost inconceivable a satisfying conclusion can be made. Not in two hours. Episode IX might be a great movie (we can hope) but I don’t see how it can be a great movie AND make these movies feel like parts of a unified whole.

    • January 18, 2018 at 8:34 pm
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      it’s sadly what’s happening. for me it’s kinda amateurish work. At least GL had all planned since 1-6.

      • January 18, 2018 at 8:41 pm
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        No, he didn’t.

        He wrote them one movie at a time and plans changed dramatically between each one. This is well-documented.

        Vader was not Luke’s father until the 2nd draft of Empire.

        Leia was not Luke’s brother until ROTJ was written.

        He made them the exact same way these are being made: one at a time, with everything subject to change.

        • January 18, 2018 at 8:45 pm
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          Not true in the story of Lucas (presented in SE bonuses) you can find Lucas wrote the story of SW on university bench cafeteria. So while i m agree with you that details changed with years, all the key elements were planned. Even in ANH when Ben talks Luke about past he mentions the Clone Wars.

        • January 18, 2018 at 8:45 pm
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          Not true in the story of Lucas (presented in SE bonuses) you can find Lucas wrote the story of SW on university bench cafeteria. So while i m agree with you that details changed with years, all the key elements were planned. Even in ANH when Ben talks Luke about past he mentions the Clone Wars.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:34 pm
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            Sorry, that’s not true. Take a look at the original treatment of Star Wars and see how drastically different it is.

            Take a look at the Making of… books and see how much changed from each draft to each movie.

            He mentions the Clone Wars, but Lucas didn’t know what those were.

            During ROTJ, Obi-Wan and Owen Lars were brothers. Anakin was older than he turned out to be, etc…

            He wrote out lots of things and he changed his mind almost constantly.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:38 pm
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            Just look at “The Art of TLJ” book. I was shocked that “The Art of TFA” book was so small. Turns out LucasFilm held out a great deal of the content because it would give away content and secrets of TLJ. So now that artwork is in “The Art of TLJ” so the thought that TLJ just through away what TFA started is silly. I expect when “The Art of EP9” comes out even more original art that was done before TFA will be included.

        • January 18, 2018 at 9:28 pm
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          The difference is Lucas evolved the story and atleast addressed every character and storyline in the next movie. RJ just wrote his own movie disregarding certain things he didn’t like from TFA. Lucas didn’t throw out ‘The Other’ in ESB and then totally disregard it as he addressed it in ROTJ and actually fleshed it out with 3 big scenes in the movie with Luke/Ben, Luke/Leia and eventually Vader using ‘the other’ to goad Luke. RJ just killed Snoke cause he didn’t want him in the Trilogy, as he said he was getting in the way of Ren’s arc. Nobody is saying the OT narrative is perfect, but it atleast fits together at the end as one big story, TFA and TLJ and eventually Episode 9 will look like 3 standalone movies.

        • January 18, 2018 at 9:28 pm
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          The difference is Lucas evolved the story and atleast addressed every character and storyline in the next movie. RJ just wrote his own movie disregarding certain things he didn’t like from TFA. Lucas didn’t throw out ‘The Other’ in ESB and then totally disregard it as he addressed it in ROTJ and actually fleshed it out with 3 big scenes in the movie with Luke/Ben, Luke/Leia and eventually Vader using ‘the other’ to goad Luke. RJ just killed Snoke cause he didn’t want him in the Trilogy, as he said he was getting in the way of Ren’s arc. Nobody is saying the OT narrative is perfect, but it atleast fits together at the end as one big story, TFA and TLJ and eventually Episode 9 will look like 3 standalone movies.

          • January 18, 2018 at 9:31 pm
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            “RJ just wrote his own movie disregarding certain things he didn’t like from TFA.”

            No, he didn’t. He addressed them in the way he wanted to. He didn’t throw them out.

            TFA and TLJ flow together pretty well, I think. He killed Snoke because the story is more interesting with Kylo in charge. Otherwise, it’s a ROTJ rehash again. Now, the directions it can go are limitless.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:49 pm
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            So he just rehashed the ROTJ Throne Room Scene in TLJ to kill Snoke just to avoid the Trilogy being a rehash? Good God you people have been drinking the RJ kool aid too long.

          • January 19, 2018 at 3:37 am
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            No, while there are parallels to the both scenes. This one is a failed attempt of what Luke ultimately achieved in ROTJ. Rian killed Snoke because he was taking the spotlight away from the villain the ST should have been focusing all its attention to from the get go. I’ve said this before and I’ll say this again, imagine if Vader killed the emperor and rules the galaxy himself. This is what’s happening. How can you not be excited?

          • January 19, 2018 at 3:51 pm
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            How is that a rehash if he took a similar scenario and did something entirely different with it?

            Vader kills Palpatine to save Luke.

            Kylo kills Snoke to overthrow him and ask Rey to join him.

            What kool aid flavor do you drink when you are wrong? DRINK IT UP.

        • January 19, 2018 at 3:32 am
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          Like the new profile pic lol.

          • January 19, 2018 at 3:49 pm
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            Yip yip yip

    • January 18, 2018 at 9:07 pm
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      Well good thing you arent making it. I for one feel that TLJ was a totally natural continuation of TFA. Why does everything presented in TFA have to be answered in TLJ? Would I have liked to see Knights of Ren in TLJ? Sure. Did it need it. No. They can easily show up in EP9. In fact, I think it is better that way. We didnt need more antagonists in TLJ. W got Snoke and Phasma out of the way in TLJ. Now the focus can be on Kylo and his Knights of Ren vs Rey and whatever she puts together.

  • January 18, 2018 at 8:10 pm
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    The Knights of Ren seemed to be a JJ invention so I’d expect something from them in Episode IX.

    • January 18, 2018 at 11:58 pm
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      Yeah Rian hates all of JJ’s inventions, which is why he shat on everything TFA for 2.5 hours. Pathetic.

  • January 18, 2018 at 8:24 pm
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    Be glad he didn’t tackle that plot thread. (Interpret this however you may.)

  • January 18, 2018 at 8:24 pm
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    Be glad he didn’t tackle that plot thread. (Interpret this however you may.)

    • January 19, 2018 at 6:47 am
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      Interesting, but the self-selected data pool means the study results only apply to users of IMDb, which is not necessarily representative of the public at large. For example, only 9% of the IMDb ratings for TLJ are from users who identify as female.

      • January 19, 2018 at 8:07 am
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        Heh.

      • January 19, 2018 at 3:17 pm
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        Not to mention the person who came up with calculations set out to prove something he/she already believed.

  • January 18, 2018 at 8:41 pm
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    I would love to see Kylo and the Knights tearing around tracking down rebel cells and kicking all sorts of ass only to turn on Kylo when Rey drops the bombshell that he killed Snoke.

    • January 18, 2018 at 9:52 pm
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      The KoR (ExJedi) were probably more loyal to Ben Solo than Snoke. Especially if they were also disillusioned with Luke’s Jedi teachings like Ben was. And Ben telling them Luke tried to kill him & Luke is insane.

      • January 18, 2018 at 9:57 pm
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        Fair enough, would like to see a Sith like betrayal then, darksiders should turn on each other, makes good movie.

        • January 18, 2018 at 10:07 pm
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          I’m tired of the Rule of Two. It failed. Its time for the KoR to help Kylo rule his new 1st Order or call it the 2nd Order.

          • January 18, 2018 at 10:16 pm
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            Return to the old days of the Sith, before Bane and the rule of two, resurrect those days.

  • January 18, 2018 at 9:13 pm
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    The Knights of Ren weren’t the only ones conspicuous by their absence. Where the hell was black squadron!? They seemed to have gotten lost in hyperspace on their way back from destroying Starkiller! Personally I think JJ has a near impossible task ahead of him writing IX. There’s so much he needs to set up and explain in one movie that this one WILL be over crowded.

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:21 am
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      Poor JJ is screwed. Rian just screwed up the Trilogy beyond repair.

      • January 19, 2018 at 1:00 am
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        I’m keeping my fingers crossed JJ can pull something out of the bag especially as he’s got Chris Terrio helping him write it. All the best Star Wars movies were a collaboration. George had huge help with the OT. JJ had Lawrence Kasdan on TFA and Gareth Edwards had help on R1. I think that’s why TLJ went a little off track as a Star Wars movie because RJ was given too much free rein.

  • January 18, 2018 at 9:14 pm
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    If I want me to get a Knights of Ren fix, I just need to re-watch The Force Awakens and make sure I don’t blink during the force back.

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:30 am
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      slow motion…

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:54 am
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        Much too challenging on my limited attention span.

  • January 18, 2018 at 9:19 pm
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    There surely must be a prequel trilogy prequel, with: origins os Snoke, Luke training Jedis and Kylo ren, the Knights of Ren… but neither the origins os Yoda we have yet…

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:40 am
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      Dear God, no.

  • January 18, 2018 at 9:19 pm
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    Can you change the name of this website to “starwarsfanswhohatestarwars.com” please? It’s far more fitting…

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:14 am
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      I would prefer: “FansWhoHateRiansStarWars.com”

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:39 am
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        Even better FansWhoHateDisneyStarWars.com

        • January 19, 2018 at 12:57 am
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          Well but I don’t hate TFA and R1, I enjoyed those films. And I will probably enjoy Han Solo.

        • January 19, 2018 at 12:57 am
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          Well but I don’t hate TFA and R1, I enjoyed those films. And I will probably enjoy Han Solo.

          • January 19, 2018 at 1:00 am
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            I do hate TFA. Not sure about R1, I fell asleep during it early on.

            Han Solo is anyone’s guess.

          • January 19, 2018 at 1:02 am
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            TFA at least looked and felt like a SW movie tho. I do hate TLJ.

          • January 19, 2018 at 1:06 am
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            I think TFA had some superficial appearances of a Star Wars movie, but for me, it felt like fan fiction through and through, as does TLJ.

  • January 18, 2018 at 9:22 pm
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    I think Kylo Ren with a gang should be either gay or teenager, or just idiot, like Ninja Turtle.

  • January 18, 2018 at 9:24 pm
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    Rian Johnson is the M Night Shamalyan of a GFFA, where his movies are all about the head fakes and the twist endings. I’m surprised Luke wasn’t throwing a Frisbee to Rey for 2 hours on the island, and when fans like us complain, the Pro-TLJ crowd would say, “Sorry, you didn’t get the story you wanted, but it’s genius because nobody thought Luke could throw a Frisbee!”

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:06 am
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      LOL so spot on.

  • January 18, 2018 at 9:36 pm
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    I thought TKOR would be the main plot line after JJ tee’d them up nicely in TFA. TKOR tearing it up across the galaxy, Rey doing her best but outgunned, Luke reluctant after his previous failures to step in, Luke realizes the only people who stop the Sith are Jedi and gets busy on new Academy. Episode 9 continues down the line and we get Jedi vs Sith and loads of cool battles between different members of each group. It’s not everyone’s cup of tea and I totally get this would be my dream film and I also understand that the majority like TLJ just the way it is which is fine. I guess that’s why RJ gets the big bucks.

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:14 am
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      I definitely wouldn’t say the majority of people like TLJ….. It’s getting the worst Fan Ratings in SW history.

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:14 am
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      I definitely wouldn’t say the majority of people like TLJ….. It’s getting the worst Fan Ratings in SW history.

  • January 18, 2018 at 9:42 pm
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    Cheerleaders: the only reason you didn’t like TLJ is because they didn’t fit your own ideas. Let the film makers tell their own story.

    Also cheerleaders: make up your own ideas to fill in the gaps, it’s not their job to tell you anything.

    Me: *head explodes*

    • January 18, 2018 at 9:47 pm
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      Oh, but it is their job to be storytellers, not teasers

    • January 18, 2018 at 11:30 pm
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      Maybe you wanted a 4 hour movie so that every gap could be sufficiently filled onscreen, particularly the ones that had little to no bearing on this part of the story?

      • January 18, 2018 at 11:39 pm
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        So.. you’d cut Finn and Rose too? 😉

        • January 18, 2018 at 11:58 pm
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          Finn is a primary character of this trilogy. The Knights of Ren are obviously not.

          • January 19, 2018 at 12:01 am
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            Twas a joke friend. About the whole “particularly the ones that had little to no bearing on this part of the story?”

        • January 19, 2018 at 12:13 am
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          I would definitely cut Rose.

          • January 19, 2018 at 12:20 am
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            I still say the actress and idea are fine. Just not the story they were given. We were introduced to her as a plucky mechanic. She fixed nothing the entire film. They easily could have had their plot line involve something mechanical for her to fix. Preferable under fire!

            Swapping the fathiers for pod racers was a real missed opportunity for her to fix something under pressure and align with slavery. Plus it’s a nice call back to the PT crowd. This is coming from a PT hater!

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:20 am
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        Lotr and sequels were 3.5, not boring at all, studios think people are afraid of long movies, well, only when they’re bad

        • January 19, 2018 at 12:49 am
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          I liked LOTR, and Return of the King was my favorite, but that movie went on for fucking forever with 15 different endings, you kept expecting it to end and then, nope, another epilogue scene.

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:37 am
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        Was there anything other than gaps in the movie?

        • January 19, 2018 at 3:15 pm
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          Name them

        • January 19, 2018 at 3:15 pm
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          Name them

      • January 19, 2018 at 7:45 pm
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        all i want is a little intellectual honesty. are we supposed let the filmmakers tell us this stuff or make it up ourselves? are the details important or not at all? is this real life or a simulation gone horribly wrong?

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:38 am
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      My favorite is the ones where they tell critics to do their research, and read 20 novels that explain all the glaring problems in the movie.

      Heh, no thanks!

  • January 18, 2018 at 9:46 pm
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    LIes, deceptions! A lot of deceptions…

  • January 18, 2018 at 10:09 pm
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    “I guess I could’ve used them in place of the Praetorian guards” … yes, you could and should have! haha I hated the movie opening night, but came around a bit on my second viewing since the film has merit for sure. Even though I did come around on the movie, I still feel like it does a pretty poor job at being a sequel in a trilogy in a lot of ways. It could have been a great/easy way to include the Knights of Ren and would have elevated Kylo’s choice to go out on his own. Seemed kinda like a no brainer, but I guess he would rather just keep adding characters to that movie.

    • January 18, 2018 at 11:19 pm
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      Or why couldn’t they simply have served as Kylo’s personal guards. if he didn’t want to directly address them in the story, fine. All he would have had to do is have them follow Kylo around in the movie as his own guards, and let JJ deal with them in IX if he wanted to.

  • January 18, 2018 at 10:14 pm
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    I’m not sure that any of the characters actually took any moral high ground, so I don’t think that’s a message that could possibly be conveyed here, even if it was intended.

    I’m also not sure how the spark of the Rebellion/Resistance is saved, when every decision that command makes in this film leads to the Rebellion/Resistance being whittled down to about a couple dozen or so.

    For example, let’s examine the lessons taught by the Holdo and Rose characters here.

    Near the end of the film, Finn is about to make the ultimate sacrifice, to destroy the battering ram weapon and save the Resistance inside of the base. Rose thwarts this effort, by crashing her ship into Finn’s. Then says, “We’re going to win this war, not by fighting what we hate, but saving what we love.” So that’s the big moral lesson, right?

    But let’s turn our attention to the Holdo Maneuver. What does she do? Well, she fights the things she hates, by ramming her starship into another.

    So why is it okay for Holdo to kill the things she hates, but but not for Finn?

    What would have happened if Poe had pulled the same action as Rose, and rammed his X-Wing into Holdo’s ship to “save” her? Would he still be accused to insubordination and not trusting leadership?

    So, most of the moral lessons in this movie are silly and contrived, and don’t really have any application in the real world.

    • January 18, 2018 at 11:48 pm
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      Good points! I had a different reaction, but I need time to write a proper reply as am on phone lol!

      There’s definitely some truth to the ‘contrived’ point, but I think Holdo’s sacrifice is quantatively and qualititively different to Finn’s or what Poe might have done.

  • January 18, 2018 at 10:21 pm
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    I agree. It’s that now they pretty much HAVE to be in the final episode, or else it is just awkward that they were ever brought up in the first place. Don’t get me wrong, I love the OT and how everything isn’t explained to a crazy degree like the prequels … I just think that Kylo being referred to as the leader of TKOR on multiple occasions makes them worth at least being present in one of the films for more than a second of a flashback. We’ll see. I think JJ has his work cut out for him. He had things stacked up against him on the first one, and now even more in a lot of ways. Also, TLJ pretty much had a solid ending and didn’t really leave much hanging for a third installment. So, who knows.

    • January 19, 2018 at 6:24 am
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      “I just think that Kylo being referred to as the leader of TKOR on multiple occasions…”

      It was not multiple occasions. It was one time.

      • January 19, 2018 at 7:54 pm
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        Snoke says it in both TFA and TLJ.

  • January 18, 2018 at 10:30 pm
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    Episode 9 opens with Snokes other Apprentice returning with his own Darkside Army chasing the KoR from the Outer Rim. Heading toward The 1st Order to challenge Kylo for leadership.

  • January 18, 2018 at 10:35 pm
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    Yeah, I think he has a tough job ahead of him, but think that he can do it. Good point with the Jabba comparison. Ok, you’ve convinced me that it’s best for Ep 9 haha. Has JJ ever taken on the final chapter of any of the reboots he’s been involved with? He has a great opportunity here to really make a great installment in the Skywalker saga. It is going to be interesting how they handle things now that Carrie is gone. Kinda sad that Kylo (as much as I love that character) is the last of the Skywalkers.

  • January 18, 2018 at 10:35 pm
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    Yeah, I think he has a tough job ahead of him, but think that he can do it. Good point with the Jabba comparison. Ok, you’ve convinced me that it’s best for Ep 9 haha. Has JJ ever taken on the final chapter of any of the reboots he’s been involved with? He has a great opportunity here to really make a great installment in the Skywalker saga. It is going to be interesting how they handle things now that Carrie is gone. Kinda sad that Kylo (as much as I love that character) is the last of the Skywalkers.

  • January 18, 2018 at 10:36 pm
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    Episode IX is the conclusion of 3 trilogies. The most important is that all makes sense. IN my opinion the knights of Ren are totally secondary now… I personally don’t care at all.

    • January 18, 2018 at 11:48 pm
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      I think the fate of lukes fallen Jedi pupils who oppose rey and worship anakin/Vader is very much in keeping with tying the trilogies together. But I agree that making a cohesive and reasonable film is paramount.

  • January 18, 2018 at 11:23 pm
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    2 years wouldn’t be anywhere near enough for a new rebellion to rise. I think it has to be at least 5 or more years.

    • January 18, 2018 at 11:43 pm
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      Yeah it could well be more than 2. I guess it depends on how far along the new Rebellion is… Maybe they’ll just go with real world timing and do 4 years. That’s how much the actors will have aged by the time 9 comes out. This could work seeing as they’ve meant to be the same age between 7 and 8. It would make up the gap.

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:45 am
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        A new rebellion would have to be pretty far along to take on the FO and win, which is what needs to happen in IX to end the saga.

    • January 19, 2018 at 1:44 am
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      I think people overestimate the size of the FO. They lost StarKiller base, they lost the dreadnaught, they lost the Supremacy and several Star Destroyers along with it. Lets not assume that the FO had a fleet the size of the Empire. The New Republic had disarmed a good deal and the New Republic fleet was taken out by StarKiller base. So I see that at the end of TLJ the FO has the advantage, but not massive.

      • January 19, 2018 at 10:36 am
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        Well that’s not how the opening crawl in TLJ makes it sound. “Supreme Leader Snoke now deploys his merciless legions to seize military control of the galaxy.” Legions implys at huge military as does seizing control of the galaxy. It would definitely have to be massive to take control of the galaxy.

        • January 19, 2018 at 3:13 pm
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          And where would you deploy the lions share of your forces. Would they be with you and Kylo going after the last military arm of the New Republic/Resistance? Wouldnt the Supreme Leader have a very large contingent of his forces protecting his ship. Would say very likely they did that and sent much smaller groups to control other systems.

  • January 18, 2018 at 11:28 pm
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    Kylo and Snoke have dispatched them to various systems of FO control to oversee occupation forces.

    • January 18, 2018 at 11:34 pm
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      …or how about Ren has changed their orders from hunting Luke to eliminating possible opposition to his rule within the FO?

      There are so many options and different threads that JJ can pull on, I don’t get all the “Ep IX is locked in on suck” comments.

  • January 18, 2018 at 11:45 pm
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    Now that we know they are the last surviving members of lukes academy I will be pretty bummed if they aren’t in 9.
    Plus It will be the first time we could see a multiple dark-Jedi fight if they all turn out to have sabers. Lots of potential here that I hope they don’t throw away

    • January 19, 2018 at 2:12 am
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      That’s what I’ve been waiting for since their introduction, a full on force battle between Rey, perhaps other people and the KOR. I want to see multiple sabers clash!!!!

      • January 20, 2018 at 7:50 am
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        yeah RJ even didn’t manage to give to us a proper ligthsaber clash. Even not a little amputation !

        Seriously i want Rey to lose a hand in 9, but this isn’t gonna happen because SW is disneyfied now !

  • January 19, 2018 at 12:04 am
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    I respect Rian’s decision, Knights of Ren are teased in 7 and 8, and since J.J. created them, it’s time for them to have huge role in episode 9.

  • January 19, 2018 at 12:10 am
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    It’s literally still sinking in to me how HORRID Rian’s Last Jedi was. I don’t think he handled any aspect of that movie well. Even the Preatorian Guards were silly and “Anime-looking” —- not very Star Wars.

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:16 am
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      Gee, thanks for clearing that up. We really weren’t sure what you thought of the movie. Thanks for finally setting the record straight. Literally.

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:26 am
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      Yeah right because that whole sub plot to the casino was so much more important to the movie…and the trilogy.?????

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:45 am
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        It was as important as Han and Leia running away from the Empire for an hour in ESB. It was about character and relationship building.

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:30 am
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      Some of their helmets looked a bit… off, but overall I liked them. Especially their fighting styles. I wish we had a bit more depth to all the proceedings but the die has been cast.

      • January 19, 2018 at 1:04 am
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        They looked too Anime tho, not very Star Wars. The entire fight sequence just looked out of place in a SW movie. Lots of “flip flop and fly” but not very engaging.

        • January 19, 2018 at 4:24 pm
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          It’s a big universe. Anime is just one style of art on our one planet. I would expect influence from all types of art within the Star Wars universe.

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:33 am
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      A lot of it actually reminded me of Disney’s Black Hole movie from the late 70s.

  • January 19, 2018 at 12:19 am
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    The JJ mystery box just keeps boxing.

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:34 am
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      Yes. Fans of LOST should suspect that no answers will be forthcoming.

  • January 19, 2018 at 12:33 am
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    Episode 9 should be like Cars 3…..just don’t acknowledge that the horrible Cars 2 ever existed…..just don’t acknowledge Episode 8 existed…. have Fin wake up from his incubation health thingy and say ” Oh man what a crazy dream!” then cut to Rey handing luke the lightsaber which begins her training when…yikes! Kilo Ren and the Knights show up..epic battle…

  • January 19, 2018 at 12:33 am
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    Episode 9 should be like Cars 3…..just don’t acknowledge that the horrible Cars 2 ever existed…..just don’t acknowledge Episode 8 existed…. have Fin wake up from his incubation health thingy and say ” Oh man what a crazy dream!” then cut to Rey handing luke the lightsaber which begins her training when…yikes! Kilo Ren and the Knights show up..epic battle…

    • January 19, 2018 at 1:04 am
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      I would literally be jumping up and down in the Theater with HAPPINESS.

    • January 19, 2018 at 2:18 am
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      Guys… ok, of course it doesnt sound bad, and if it had been the plot, probably it had been ok and most of the people would like it, BUT… is it not just another Empire Strike Back plot? The new pupil find a master that teachs him and then he/she fight against the bad guys… which is also the typical plot of hundreds of movies… c’mon if you want it just watch ESB, it’s so good movie!
      I’m so so happy what RJ did, he took the story and bring it to another level, much more interesting one, where the teacher is not that thing anymore, the pupil is there almost to save the master and the bad guy is in a difficult time dealing with what he really is…
      If this is divisive, please, bring me 40 more divisive movies like this one 😉

      • January 19, 2018 at 3:32 am
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        WHAT, it’s literally the same story as the OT, minor twist, and crapping all over the OT.

        Galaxy full of white armored storm troopers led by evil darksider with special blood. Small band of rebels, need the hope a untrained Jedi from a sandy planet brings. After first being reluctant, master trains Jedi, kind of. Jedi Master disappears into force after making sacrifice. Hope restored.

        Short of the little things, and the complete denigrating of Luke and Han, Rey doing everything she wants with no training and little effort. Is that the big bold new directing. Oh, Darth Snoke the useless died after New Hope 2.0 confronts him.

        • January 19, 2018 at 5:02 am
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          I starting to question if you saw the actual film or whether you just need attention.

        • January 19, 2018 at 12:53 pm
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          Yes, it so close, you are right! But even like this there is still complains that seems that they want it even closer!
          Althought… “white armored stormtroopers in galaxy”… after my first watching of EP.6 i remember I thought: “but what’s now? they destroyed a weapon and kill the emperor, but they didn’t say the Empire surrrender, if someone take over in the power… The rebellion was still small compared with the Empire forces (as far as I knew and read about it).
          And Rey no training? Well, yes and no. She can use a sword, she seemed to have hard life in Jakku and she probably learned to fight long ago. Use the force? The way she uses the force is quite basic. She didn’t really understand that yet as a jedi, she just show that she found the way to use it in some way with self-control. And now she had Luke teaching her.
          Jedi from a sandy planet? You right here, they should be more original on it, same with Starkiller base of course, that was pretty dumb.
          “Luke and Han denigrated”. I see your point, but I don’t know why I found it so powerful. Imagine your son orn nephew end up being Kylo Ren… Han was being Han. And Luke, he was the real one torn apart.

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:43 pm
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        Right, who needs a hero journey anyway…

        • January 19, 2018 at 5:18 pm
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          About this topic is really interesting the Bradon Sanderson essay about Campbell Myth and the heroes travel (sorry about my english)

    • January 20, 2018 at 2:58 am
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      I love the idea of Finn waking up from a “bad dream”. I could also get behind giving JJ two episodes to “fix” the damage done by Last Jedi. Extend the Skywalker saga to 10 episodes.

      I would also love if they went ahead and made Star Wars 9 all fan service. Star Wars Episode 9: We’re Sorry About Last Jedi & Solo. Just pack it full of over the top stuff the fans would love, fuck it, at this point why not? Open the movie up with Rey & Finn on a mission to find a Jedi apostate, have them get into trouble in some seedy bar and out of the shadows a white lightsaber blade ignites: It’s Asoka on the big screen! Fans would love it. I’m not even a fan of that character but I know tons of people are and they’d love it. Make Benicio Del Toro into Ezra, boom, instant drama between Asoka and Benicio and it won’t feel forced because it’s been built up on the television cartoons.

      Go even further and say “fuck you Rian” and bring back Snoke. Have him be Kylo’s slave, all cobbled together with machines and the Dark side. Barely alive, living only to serve his former apprentice. That would make Kylo even more creepy and truly evil.

      • January 23, 2018 at 10:00 pm
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        Fuck the fans

        • January 24, 2018 at 12:12 am
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          Reads like the notes Kathy Kennedy gave to Rian Johnson while working on Last Jedi.

        • January 24, 2018 at 12:12 am
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          Reads like the notes Kathy Kennedy gave to Rian Johnson while working on Last Jedi.

          • January 24, 2018 at 3:42 pm
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            Nah. Reads like someone who has read Star Wars online for 18 years and finds you all LACKING IN GOOD IDEAS.

          • January 24, 2018 at 3:42 pm
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            Nah. Reads like someone who has read Star Wars online for 18 years and finds you all LACKING IN GOOD IDEAS.

  • January 19, 2018 at 1:21 am
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    This is the lamest excuse I’ve ever heard RJ should have deleted the whole scenes with Finn and Rose and instead put the Knights of Ren in there. That would have made the movie much much better.

    I have nothing against the actors who played Finn and Rose they’re good, but that casino scene just didn’t really have to be in the movie. If I had a choice I’d much rather have the Knights of Ren over the casino.

    After TFA I was eager to learn more about this Knights group. And assumed it would be in episode 8. Why it was left out there’s no excuse.

    • January 19, 2018 at 1:26 am
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      I love Finn but I can’t stand Rose. Her character seems far better for SW Rebels cartoons or something, not a major motion picture.

      • January 19, 2018 at 5:01 am
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        I bet people will warm up to Rose. When the Clone Wars movie came out, fans hated Ahsoka, but after a few seasons of Clone Wars they started liking her.

        • January 19, 2018 at 5:33 am
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          No chance. Rose has been panned by the fandom. Again, she would be fine in the Cartoon Shows, not a major motion picture.

        • January 19, 2018 at 8:08 am
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          They started liking her because the CW writers developed her far, FAR beyond the shitty character they introduced in season one. It’s possible Rose gets more development in 9, but as is? No, that’s not a good analogy at all.

      • January 20, 2018 at 2:34 am
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        I was thinking she was there for the chinese market. But she is vietnamese and chinese audience only cares about beutiful chinese or beautiful caucasian people. If I know this then Disney and Lucasfilm knows this as well….and the result is what we see. They ignore the movie in China. To be fair, the script is responsible as well

    • January 19, 2018 at 2:09 am
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      Yea but how can you include a group of highly experienced individuals in a movie like TLJ? Who will they fight? How will they end up surviving? If you put em against Rey obviously nothing is going to happen to our hero in the middle film so that wouldn’t work and it’ll fuel the “Mary sue” crowd even more when she ultimately wins, if you put em against Luke, they will die so that’s a waste, and if you put em against Finn and Rose it could end 1 of two ways, either Finn and Rose vs. a group of Phasmas or Finn and Rose getting their ass beat. It’s better to save em for IX where the real consequences are going to kick in, and Supreme leader Kylo Ren can have them doing his bidding. That is, if J.J. includes them of course.

      • January 20, 2018 at 2:31 am
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        What, TLJ didn’t duel Mary Sue Rey? Beating someone with years of training and elite guards? I see no difference. No, with the Ren she would just continue to be the Mary Sue she is

        • January 20, 2018 at 2:48 am
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          He was using a stick? He bested her and then she whipped out a lightsaber. She didn’t really “beat him” nor was she trying to kill him.

        • January 20, 2018 at 2:48 am
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          He was using a stick? He bested her and then she whipped out a lightsaber. She didn’t really “beat him” nor was she trying to kill him.

  • January 19, 2018 at 2:11 am
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    “Kylo Ren is a considerable opponent on his own..” Hold up. Did we watch the same two movies here? He got has arse handed to him twice!

      • January 19, 2018 at 6:29 am
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        Mary Sue can do it all, and doesn’t even need any Training, parents, NOTHING!

        • January 19, 2018 at 12:40 pm
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          We didn’t see any female Jedi heroes. What if the Force acts differently in women? What if women are stronger and much easy to learn or doesn’t really need a training?

          • January 19, 2018 at 1:18 pm
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            then there wouldn’t be any need for male jedi, why bother if it takes them years to accomplish what someone else is genetically born with

          • January 19, 2018 at 7:39 pm
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            Then the Force is sexist AF

          • January 20, 2018 at 7:32 am
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            There was plenty of female jedis in PT era on and off big screen.

    • January 19, 2018 at 8:07 am
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      Agree with this. I don’t know how this is supposed to be a dramatically compelling confrontation in 9 when Rey has beaten Ren twice now. It would take some creative as hell writing to make this showdown interesting in any way. Creativity I fear JJ just doesn’t posess.

  • January 19, 2018 at 3:23 am
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    R.J. Acts like he had to write this movie and every excuse is based off of that idea. JJ left you a decent template, you mangled it. Own it.

    • January 19, 2018 at 4:45 am
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      Personally I put the faults of 8 on JJ a lot. His movies including Episode 7 are all fluff and no heart. Ryan tried to put meaning behind the weak mysteries JJ setup and he managed to give Kylo a meaningful fall to the darkside, a betrayal by his uncle and it works really well. It gave him a reason to kill his dad and act like a whiny Brat in 7. I don’t know how else Kylo’s fall could have been meaningful after 7 and other clues given in different media. The problem is it doesn’t work nearly as well for Luke’s character. But again I don’t fault that for Ryan so much because he was boxed in.

      • January 19, 2018 at 5:00 am
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        Although I disagree with a few of your points, I’m glad I found someone that actually thought through why TLJ is the way it is. Thank you!

      • January 19, 2018 at 5:00 am
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        Although I disagree with a few of your points, I’m glad I found someone that actually thought through why TLJ is the way it is. Thank you!

    • January 19, 2018 at 6:08 am
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      It was so EASY for Rian to please the fans in Ep 8. All fans wanted was: Rey gives Saber to Luke, Luke at first hesitates to help, Luke then sees INSPIRATION AND HOPE in Rey, Luke trains Rey, Luke + Rey then EMBARK together to save the Galaxy.

      I always envisioned Ep 9 ending with Rey vs Kylo and Luke vs Snoke. Which would literally have had crowds cheering like Wrestlemania.

      • January 19, 2018 at 3:10 pm
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        So basically you wanted the end of ROTS all over again? Maybe with a different outcome like the light side users winning. Or maybe exactly like ROTS ending setting up another trilogy where Luke and Rey go into hiding.

  • January 19, 2018 at 3:33 am
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    So we scrapped the new original baddies in place of Sidious guard rip offs.

    • January 19, 2018 at 4:58 am
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      They were not rip offs. It is explicitly explained in the visual dictionary that they are meant to mimic the fierceness and sleekness of the original guards.

  • January 19, 2018 at 4:40 am
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    I have to disagree with the idea that the Knight of Ren were an, “obvious thread(s) dangling from the Force Awakens”. They were offhandedly mentioned.

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:12 pm
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      You’re right on point. Just like many of those “mysteries” people want to obsess about and want to believe they’re important plot threads.

      It’s like being pissed at the Prequels because they didn’t develop the Sifo Dyas plot, for instance, or many, many other offhand comments made in both the PT and the OT.

      We just live in a time of perpetual anger, it seems.

      • January 19, 2018 at 1:48 pm
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        Yes, people are nowadays bitching about EVERYTHING. All sucks, nothing is good.

        It is a very sad time, people are too toxic.

        • January 19, 2018 at 7:48 pm
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          People especially love to bitch about other people bitching if they don’t share the same point of view ;p

      • January 19, 2018 at 7:47 pm
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        I wish they had explained the Sifo Dyas plot. I don’t read comics or books so I’m still in the dark.

        So, yeah. That’s fair game.

        • January 20, 2018 at 1:02 am
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          Yep. Yet nobody obsesses over the Sifo Dyas thing.

          Clearly, the problem nowadays is the way we use the internet to vent our opinions (both for and against)

          It’s normal to disagree, but our online personas blow the debates out of proportion. All of this TLJ internet fandom war is almost like a Black Mirror episode.

      • January 19, 2018 at 10:00 pm
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        It annoys me that most SW fans seem to want a movie full of footnote answers as opposed to an actual story. Buy a reference book if you only want answers

    • January 19, 2018 at 1:49 pm
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      If they were sooo important, why they didn’t help Kylo in The Force Awakens? Why they didn’t help save Starkiller Base???

      And now people come to harrass Rian?

      • January 19, 2018 at 3:39 pm
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        Unfortunately that’s how some parts of the ‘Star Wars’ fandom work by now. Everything was fine with Lucas until the prequels came along. Then Disney, Kathleen Kennedy and Abrams became the object of their hatred for making TFA too much like ANH, disrespecting Lucas and setting up too many mysteries. Now a lot of the same people love Abrams and think Johnson, Kennedy and Disney ruined everything he set up.

        • January 19, 2018 at 3:59 pm
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          They are only interested in hate, nitpicking, criticize. No more simple apreciation, “go for the ride”. That fraction of the fan base thinks they understand the franchise more than the creators. And they keep proving that they don’t really understand anything about it.

  • January 19, 2018 at 5:30 am
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    Man, Star Wars fans hate Star Wars movies. Sad!

    • January 19, 2018 at 6:27 am
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      We just hate The Last Jedi and Prequels.

      • January 19, 2018 at 10:23 am
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        And some just the Last Jedi ;P

        • January 19, 2018 at 12:09 pm
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          Exactly. The prequels make TLJ look like a B movie. I wouldn’t even compare the scope of the prequels with TLJ. They are way better.

          • January 29, 2018 at 8:22 pm
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            The PT almost killed Star Wars.

  • January 19, 2018 at 5:33 am
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    I’m glad that Rian made short work of JJs “mysteries”. Snoke is better dead. Rey being no one is perfect. Knights of ren? Who cares?
    The emperor had zero backstory. (Until ’99)
    The Sith were a mystery. (Until ’99)
    if JJ wants to bring them back in 9, fine. But unless it’s integral to the story, unless it’s really interesting, why bother? Maybe ren killed them. Maybe ren left them behind and they are unimportant. Shrug. Put it in a book.
    Rian was smart to eject all these tangents. Rey and ren. Finn. Poe. Thats who I’m interested in now.

    • January 19, 2018 at 6:06 am
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      Yeah let’s ditch JJ’s tangeants for much more quality content such as: Rose, grumpy-Luke, Canto Bight, Rey-Kylo “Force Facetime”, Holdo, etc. Great.

      • January 19, 2018 at 6:36 am
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        You forgot the biggest tangent of them all, the entire character that is Admiral Holdo. No reason that couldn’t have just been Leia.

        • January 19, 2018 at 7:00 am
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          Absolutely bro. Holdo was a complete waste — every moment, every line, every time she was on screen. Total waste of time that COULD have been better suited for Leia.

          • January 19, 2018 at 12:35 pm
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            My favourite character of this comedy were Hux and the big nose woman

          • January 19, 2018 at 12:35 pm
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            My favourite character of this comedy were Hux and the big nose woman

        • January 19, 2018 at 7:03 am
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          Easy to say with hindsight knowing Carrie Fisher died, but had she not, fans would complain that they killed off Leia.

        • January 19, 2018 at 8:04 am
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          No. It CAN’T. She is there to drive Poe’s arc. THAT’S. IT. That’s her whole purpose. She’s a device to get him to grow from being a hothead to being a leader. To do that, in Poe’s arc as written, you need someone he doesn’t trust, but who turns out to have been right all along. Now, that writing could have been stronger, but the fact remains that you CAN’T have that person be Leia, or Ackbar, or ANYONE that the audience trusts already, otherwise there’s no reason for Poe to doubt them.

          • January 19, 2018 at 8:08 pm
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            Poe acted nothing like he acted in TFA. The “prank call” to the First Order, getting degraded by Holdo, getting smacked by Leia, getting stunned by Leia, terrible vandalism of character.

          • January 22, 2018 at 6:39 pm
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            Well said.

  • January 19, 2018 at 6:57 am
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    It is difficult to imagine who they will be a match for in IX.

    For me one clear remaining point is that Kylo lied to Hux about who killed Snoke. So there is still the possibility for the First Order to turn against him in some way. In this pattern there could be some three way battle between first order, resistance, and knights of ren.

    One other possible openening is that Finn finds a way to recondition the storm troopers. In this pattern knights of ren would be leading the stormtroopers, and Finn’s act would turn them against knights of ren – like order 66.

    • January 19, 2018 at 11:50 am
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      Hux knows that Kylo lied. He just doesn’t have the means to overthrow him yet, but that is obviously his intention. Forget about Finn becoming the leader of a ST rebellion. That was the fanbase hope and would have been an original and interesting twist on his character, but RJ chose instead to make Finn useless.

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:34 pm
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        Hux is but a clown, no serious threat to anyone

        • January 19, 2018 at 10:23 pm
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          Hux wasn’t a clown in TFA. RJ wrote him as a clown in TLJ, wasting yet another potentially great character.

  • January 19, 2018 at 10:47 am
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    It looks obvious to me that the Knights of Ren are awaiting for Episode IX. That shot in the rain is too epic as to be left behind, and JJ and Rian have surely talked about where to place those guys in the trilogy. Another hint to that for me is the fact that we have never seen behind the scenes footage of the knights of ren, nor action figures or any original material in which we see them clearly (concept art a part). That shot in the rain is dark and blurry to create hype.

    • January 19, 2018 at 11:47 am
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      So Rey, the last Jedi, will go up against Kylo and the Knights of Ren in Episode IX and beat them all ? Or maybe she will enlist the help of the Broom Boy , who will also become a Jedi knight after having two lessons about the force .

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:10 pm
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        The rey vs. all of them scenario seems unlikely to me. There needs to be something more… unless she trains everyone to use the force.

        • January 20, 2018 at 7:16 am
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          Not everyone can use the Force. You have it or you don’t have it. it’s just sensitvity. Try to learn the way of the Force to Han Solo

        • January 20, 2018 at 7:16 am
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          Not everyone can use the Force. You have it or you don’t have it. it’s just sensitvity. Try to learn the way of the Force to Han Solo

          • January 20, 2018 at 11:36 am
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            You are of course correct so far. But Disney have been laying a trail suggesting that the force is much bigger than that.

            Some elements of that are Chirrut in R1, and Luke saying that this power does not belong to the jedi, and even Maz in TFA knowing the force but not being a jedi. It would be sacrilege to do it in IX, but they are opening some doorway in my opinion to a world where those sensitive to the force are much more than a select few.

          • January 21, 2018 at 12:21 am
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            yeah you are right but i never said Jedis or Siths only could use the Force. We have the Massassis too for example though maybe they belongs to Legends now.ofc i m ok for others factions of force users. That said, the fact Rey is so good with barely no training is a bit hard to swallow. Even Anakin the chosen one, needed 15 years to become the ‘potentially’ most powerful Jedi Knight we know, and then he failed. For me Rey is clearly cheated in this regard. But oh well Lucas did that a bit too with Luke. But the gaps between 4 and 5 can suggest offscreen Jedi training

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:33 pm
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        I have no doubt Rey beats just everyone. Or have you seen her lose till now?

      • January 19, 2018 at 1:44 pm
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        We don’t know the time interval between VII and IX. It is possible that Rey train or find capable allies. A very good reason to new characters in the movie, and canon.

    • January 19, 2018 at 2:35 pm
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      This is a bit of lose-lose situation for Johnson. Either some fans were going to be pissed off he killed them off too quickly or they were going to be pissed off he didn’t include them at all.

      I agree that they’re probably coming back to support Kylo Ren in Episode IX now that both Snoke and his Praetorians are gone. It would honestly be one point I would maybe hold against the film for not addressing if things turn out differently. Just “maybe”, though. They really haven’t been relevant to either TFA or TLJ’s stories.

      • January 19, 2018 at 2:57 pm
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        Every movie from here on out will be in this lose-lose situation:
        It’s a re-hash vs. it’s too different from the originals.
        Too many new characters vs. same old stuff.
        I want new aliens – I want familiar aliens.
        He/she died too quickly vs. why didn’t he/she sacrifice hermself sooner.
        Too much CGI vs not enough special effects.
        The only constant that we can expect from these new movies is the crying.

        These directors are not going to be received well by everyone and maybe not even by most. Which, in a way, if they know this before going into the production they can say ‘screw it’ and make the movie they want to make. And I think that’s what Rian did. So, good for him.

        • January 19, 2018 at 3:05 pm
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          True. It’s why I’m really curious about Johnson’s trilogy. I generally like what he’s done for ‘Star Wars’ so far and I really want to see what he can do within the same universe with some extra freedom.

      • January 22, 2018 at 6:01 pm
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        Shouldn’t people who hated The Last Jedi be relieved that Rian Johnson didn’t use them? They seem to hate everything he touches.

        • January 22, 2018 at 6:02 pm
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          That would be the logical conclusion, yes.

  • January 19, 2018 at 11:44 am
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    For me the question is if Rey´s vision in the rain was the future or the past.
    I don´t believe her vision was Luke´s Academy, although I am not aware if that has been already confirmed like that. What we saw in Ep.VIII was not raining if I recall well.
    So it could be part of something happening in Ep. IX.

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:12 pm
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      I think someplace else but still in the past.

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:32 pm
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        Because of the helmet?

        • January 19, 2018 at 12:44 pm
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          There are no other future images.

      • January 19, 2018 at 1:41 pm
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        Me too. Because, after Ben assaults Luke in the incident of the misunderstanding, there must have a future confrontation of some kind. With Ben as a Knight of Ren, the group formed by Snoke. It cannot be in the same day.

      • January 19, 2018 at 1:41 pm
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        Me too. Because, after Ben assaults Luke in the incident of the misunderstanding, there must have a future confrontation of some kind. With Ben as a Knight of Ren, the group formed by Snoke. It cannot be in the same day.

      • January 19, 2018 at 2:12 pm
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        Yes, may be it was only to show us the knights of Ren, so they should appear in Ep. IX in the present of the movie.

      • January 19, 2018 at 2:12 pm
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        Yes, may be it was only to show us the knights of Ren, so they should appear in Ep. IX in the present of the movie.

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:31 pm
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      Doesn’t matter. If Ren were former Jedi students so they have lightsabers, no ancient China weapons. And also that means that Luke was by far the worst teacher ever. In 1000 generations only 20 Jedi ever left the order, and now we have up to 8 students of Luke turning to the dark side (without Luke even notice – remember he saw darknes only in Ben…..and wanted to murder him in sleep for that)

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:43 pm
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        We do not know if all of them were Luke’s students.

        • January 20, 2018 at 2:18 am
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          Prequels 6years old kids had sabre. Because of the training. Now it is different?

          • January 20, 2018 at 7:09 am
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            The level of duellism drasticly lowered since Prequels. The only way Luke could Have learnt lightsaber fighting would have been with holodiscs. Mace Windu would kick Ren ass in 5 sec. Same for Luke

          • January 20, 2018 at 7:15 am
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            They were found from birth. We have no idea at what age, when, and how Luke found his students. It took Luke until ROTJ to make his own light sabre (ok possibly he had no necessity until he lost his hand) to which Vader said your skills are complete – indeed you are powerful….

      • January 19, 2018 at 12:48 pm
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        Not for sure that they were all at a level to make a sabre.

      • January 19, 2018 at 2:18 pm
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        If that vision is part of ep.IX it matters to me.

        • January 20, 2018 at 2:19 am
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          Kylo destroyed the helmet in 8, but you are right. JJ can ivent anything for 9, there are no limits…

          • January 20, 2018 at 3:57 am
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            That´s right, I forgot that detail. Then most probably is the past.

  • January 19, 2018 at 12:03 pm
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    This franchise is done. Rian Johnson didn’t set anything up with TLJ. He undid everything. There isn’t any anticipation for episode IX. If the Knights of Ren appear in the next movie who’s gonna face them off alone, Rey? She isn’t even a Jedi. Besides Rian Johnson has to explain to me how Ren could have been able to kill Snoke, one of the most powerful being in the galaxy, when he got his ass kicked by Rey in TFA and Rey had never even been trained in the ways of the force. According to Andy Serkis: Snoke was even more powerful than the Emperor. Well, it doesn’t make any sense. Poor storytelling!!!

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:28 pm
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      Sadly you are right with me. I will not buy the bluray simply because I have no desire to rewatch this movie ever, it’s just too stupid…..the same with 9, this trilogy is dead to me and it’s a shame, I really liked Rey and would love to see her adventure….and I’m sorry for Hamill, Luke was my favourite character…what’s worse many of my friends who wasn’t fanboy but always enjoyed the saga feel the same

      • January 19, 2018 at 1:20 pm
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        Yip that’s the problem. I’m a bit of a Star Was fan and I don’t care what happens anymore. My kids are casual fans and they deffinetly thought it was boring. Lots of TLJ fan have described it as beautiful, I get that films can be but come on it’s Star Wars at the end of the day and that shouldn’t be the overriding thought as you leave the cinema.

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:29 pm
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      Speak for yourself. I am looking forward to IX. There is so much story still to tell. Seems you have plenty of questions too.

      Disney have intentionally made movies that provoke questions – like the original trilogy. Leaves a lot of space for non-saga movies and other media.

      It could even be that Snoke is not dead. That thing cut in half might just be some puppet, or maybe he can reconstitute himself.

      At the end of TFA – and you can choose to trust it or not – but Han said Snoke will crush Ben when he gets what he wants. Can Han’s final words be so wrong… Can it be that Snoke’s own last words were so wrong?

      I still think there is a chance that Snoke is not entirely gone. In which case did Snoke get what he wanted already? Does he have an axe to grind with Kylo?

      The alternative is that of course he died like a punk – but in that case it also makes sense that he was over confident.

      • January 19, 2018 at 1:30 pm
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        all your points are why the two films dont line up, and JJ may be able to come back and recreate what was so great about Awakens, but, yes, Rian did a pretty good job of just destroying everything

        • January 19, 2018 at 2:13 pm
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          I disagree. He made a natural story of what would have most probably happened directly after the battle of Yavin. I think they line up just fine.

          Problem is more the fan boys that want everything addressed that was brought up in TFA. I am happy to wait for IX. It isn’t over until the fat jabba sings.

          • January 19, 2018 at 4:30 pm
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            that is the point of a sequel, to address the original plot and expand on it.
            Neither happened here

          • January 19, 2018 at 7:12 pm
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            I was happy with the extent of elaboration. Not everything needed elaborating on.
            Jabba did not need to appear in the OT until ROTJ.

      • January 19, 2018 at 2:04 pm
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        You are clearly in denial if you think that Snoke will be back!!!It ain’t gonna happen!!!

        • January 19, 2018 at 2:10 pm
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          Say that to Yoda, Ben, Anakin, and Qui Gonn. You can even shoot lightening after death now. Anything is possible.

          • January 19, 2018 at 7:01 pm
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            i am beside myself with the hilarious comments the people who like this movie make..I bet you would be estatic if they announced that most of Kylo’s frustrations are based on the fact that he is a transgender and identifies as a woman and nobody understands him…that is why he is such a crybaby..or when you read the book and find out that Leia and Holdo were Lesbian lovers and THAT is why Han and Leia were estranged when we see them in Ep7….those who like TLJ….these are the kinds of things you people would enjoy.OMG you people would be overjoyed wouldnt ya?..as for the rest of us…we just want a damn star wars movie…and we would like the Episodes in our trilogy to actually tie in to the main story of the entire saga….not pull the carpet out from under us mid trilogy and change everything, contradict the first 7 movies and completely destroy official Canon…..based on whats happened in this new trilogy…it was absolutely pointless to even include the big three..it was pointles to even continue this saga….they would have been better off starting 100 years after the fall of the Empire…Han Luke and Leia were nothing more than marketing tools. and btw genius…Darkside Force users cannot come back as force ghosts, which is why they are so obsessed with defying death….but hey..maybe Kathleen Kennedy will wipe her ass with that Page of the Star Wars canon bible too…Disney forgets that this is not a movie for Americans….this is a movie for the whole world… and most countries do not agree with American points of view..The Chinese HATE this movie…they werent to keen on all the feminism

          • January 19, 2018 at 7:01 pm
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            i am beside myself with the hilarious comments the people who like this movie make..I bet you would be estatic if they announced that most of Kylo’s frustrations are based on the fact that he is a transgender and identifies as a woman and nobody understands him…that is why he is such a crybaby..or when you read the book and find out that Leia and Holdo were Lesbian lovers and THAT is why Han and Leia were estranged when we see them in Ep7….those who like TLJ….these are the kinds of things you people would enjoy.OMG you people would be overjoyed wouldnt ya?..as for the rest of us…we just want a damn star wars movie…and we would like the Episodes in our trilogy to actually tie in to the main story of the entire saga….not pull the carpet out from under us mid trilogy and change everything, contradict the first 7 movies and completely destroy official Canon…..based on whats happened in this new trilogy…it was absolutely pointless to even include the big three..it was pointles to even continue this saga….they would have been better off starting 100 years after the fall of the Empire…Han Luke and Leia were nothing more than marketing tools. and btw genius…Darkside Force users cannot come back as force ghosts, which is why they are so obsessed with defying death….but hey..maybe Kathleen Kennedy will wipe her ass with that Page of the Star Wars canon bible too…Disney forgets that this is not a movie for Americans….this is a movie for the whole world… and most countries do not agree with American points of view..The Chinese HATE this movie…they werent to keen on all the feminism

          • January 19, 2018 at 7:25 pm
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            I am sorry that all your first criticism centres around unfounded concepts of the characters’ sexual orientation.

            From my perspective, TLJ is a blend of ESB and ROTJ. The whole idea that you did not get a star wars movie is mute, and probably more founded in watching the OT through rose colored glasses.

            I think it ties in just fine with TFA, the previous six movies, and R1.

          • January 19, 2018 at 9:38 pm
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            hahah ties in just fine with TLJ…LOL.
            so please explain…how exactly does episode 8 have ANYTHING to do with TFA? episode 8 is supposed to happen exactly right after TFA, but yet…there is no kylo training..he has a different scar, the storm trooopers were all equiped with new armor and different helmets overnight?, now all of a sudden they can track through hyperspace. ( apparently figured it out the day starkiller base was destroyed..since you know..that technology wasnt even used the DAY BEFORE)…you could write a novel on how much this movie does not tie into Episode 7..but please…feel free to explain since most of us have obviously missed something… Oh it ties into the the previous 6 movies as well? I would love to hear your explanation of THIS also. Explain to us all here how the rise and fall of Darth Vader has any meaning anymore and what the point was? Considering He turned to the Darkside of the force for one reason only…and that was to learn the DARKSIDE ONLY power of preventing death…a power only one had ever acheived..and VAder himself never acheived it..but all of a sudden SUPER LEIA…an Untrained force sensetive just happens to conveniently have the most powerful Force ability just naturally and brings herself back to life. also while you are at it…Please also explain how R1 ties in to ANY of this… Considering in R1 the plans were beamed to a COMMAND ship and not the tantive IV… and even though Vader chases the group of Soldiers holding the Disc with the plans..in episode 4 he says ” several transmission were beamed aboard this ship..i want to kow what happened to the plans they sent you”…ummm even though ACCORDING TO ROGUE ONE he knew for a fact the plans were NOT beamed there and he was killing soldiers trying to get the DISC. Why would Leia try to explain that she was part of the imperial senate on a diplomatic mission, even though Vader had been chasing her ship from a battle she just fled from, on a ship where he had already wiped out a bunch of rebel troops? vader taking out rebels like he was in his prime and tossing them around with the force…but then the next day he fights obi wan like he is an 80 year old man? please explain to me how R1 even ties into anything in the saga and isnt just a stand alone film in some multiverse, since it contradicts everythign in Episode4..i mean..i can go on and on and on BUT..i cant wait to hear your wise explanation for these things…they have been driving me nuts…i cannot wait to be clued in so i can finally have peace and stop hating Kathleen Kennedy…

          • January 20, 2018 at 1:18 am
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            The troopers come from a different division where they decided to invest in different weapons and a different set of molds for the armour. This was at a phase in period where some had the priveledge of getting the minor face change armour.

            The light speed tracking device already existed that is how they could find the resistance base so quickly, compared to the timescale between ANH amd ESB.

            In R1 the plans were beamed to the ship that housed the Tantive. He could alternatively say “transmissions were beamed to this ship, copied to a disc, and passed by a group of rebels that I slaughtered to one of your underlings on this ship that was inside the bigger one”, but it does not roll off the tongue so well. I am sure when we see Solo that a ship inside a ship / consisting of two parts will still be considered to be one ship – at least from a certain point of view.

            We do not know on the other hand whether they manage to chase the Tantive directly, or they lose it for some time and then find it again. I suspect the latter. Hence, Leia can claim that she knows nothing of the plans and is on a diplomatic mission to Alderaan. The ship was not directly damaged in the battle. It may have no particular distinctive markings.

            I suspect the main reason for the difference in Vader’s fighting style is mainly the era in which the movie is made. You are not complaining about Vader’s forward improvement from ANH to ESB. It is possible that the bacta treatment improves his physique temporarily, and that without taking a bath he starts to become decrepit- just like if you fail to cream your own severe wounds. By the time he meets Obi Wan in ANH, he has been out of his bacta bath for a long time and is getting irritable. Same goes for ESB – really irritable for the first half of the movie – probably not enough bacta.

          • January 25, 2018 at 6:15 pm
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            Snoke’s training of Kylo was to berate him and then use him to get Rey. Watch Star Wars, bro.
            New helmets? HAHAHAHAHAHA. Watch Star Wars, bro.

            you have such a casual knowledge of what is happening here. It’s fascinating.

            You’ll always hate Kennedy; she is a woman.

          • January 25, 2018 at 6:15 pm
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            Snoke’s training of Kylo was to berate him and then use him to get Rey. Watch Star Wars, bro.
            New helmets? HAHAHAHAHAHA. Watch Star Wars, bro.

            you have such a casual knowledge of what is happening here. It’s fascinating.

            You’ll always hate Kennedy; she is a woman.

          • January 20, 2018 at 1:08 am
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            My first thought when they announced a trilogy was exactly that – 100 years in the future, new villains (no Empire 2.0), new heroes (no rebels again). The past six movies have a great ending, this was an opportunity to start something fresh. If they wanted a Skywalker, why not Luke and Leia’s grandchildren….

          • January 22, 2018 at 4:12 pm
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            Wow. You really Like ellipses Dave.

          • January 22, 2018 at 4:12 pm
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            Wow. You really Like ellipses Dave.

          • January 25, 2018 at 6:16 pm
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            You sound like a cucked snowflake. Who triggered you?

        • January 20, 2018 at 6:48 am
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          They ve brought Maul back, but not on big screen, ok

    • January 19, 2018 at 6:09 pm
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      “This franchise is done. Rian Johnson didn’t set anything up with TLJ. He undid everything. There isn’t any anticipation for episode IX.”

      “amazing. Everything you said is wrong.”

      • January 19, 2018 at 6:53 pm
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        Andrew…you truly are lost…instead of just being a troll, why dont you explain to the rest of the class why we are all wrong.. explain to us why episode 8 was not a complete and total Epic fail…. thanks

    • January 20, 2018 at 6:45 am
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      To be honest Reb killed Snoke cowardly, byt i am agrre it’s still weak in the end.

  • January 19, 2018 at 12:31 pm
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    I think if JJ really wanted the KoR to be something significant he should have used them more in TFA. If you think about it JJ told us a very small part of the whole story, he introduced Snoke, the KoR but didn’t tell us anything about them. He just teased Snoke, the KoR, the parentage of Rey, and the fate of Finn and Phasma…etc.

    I think Rian wasn’t satisfied with what JJ left to him to continue. He’s hands were pretty much tied, but he wanted to tell his own story, and ultimately he did. The continuity did suffer this decision, but I think it’s not just Rian’s fault, but JJ’s too.

    I wanted to see more of the KoR but I understand why they aren’t in this film. At this point i’m not even sure if I want to see them in ep IX.

    • January 20, 2018 at 6:43 am
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      i think you pretty nailed it in your second paragraph. But seriously how this can happens on saga SW movie ?§ Even Rogue One fells more coherent with the SW feel. Heck, Rebels too (i m watching season 4 now so KK should have just tell that guys to do the movies, i mean seriously)

  • January 19, 2018 at 12:37 pm
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    The fact that the KoR were only seen in flashback, and then were absent for the next episode, sort of tells me they were an historical group and around no more *now*. It would feel even more shoe-horned if they were to make an appearance in IX, surely ?? Their absence would have to be explained as well as their (old &) current purpose.

    • January 19, 2018 at 12:47 pm
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      But Snoke refered to Kylo as the master of the knights of Ren. So I at least was presuming they were still around.

    • January 19, 2018 at 1:28 pm
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      we just have to accept that no effort was put into connecting Last Jedi with Force Awakens, It is admitted that the script for ep 8 was finished before ep 7 finished.
      This lame attempt to backpedal why so much was abandoned from the great setup by JJ , is becoming crazier by the day.
      I guess “bold” and “visionary” didn’t cut it

  • January 19, 2018 at 1:23 pm
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    Im so glad we have these chats with Rian, Here I was all these years watching movies, but not knowing how to watch them.
    He could make his next career out of explaining how to do things the Rian way: watch movies, eat breakfast, wash the car, you know the stuff that most people see and do and end up scratching their heads.
    Thank You Rian, where would we be without you,… oh yeah probably rewatching ep 8 in the theater

    • January 20, 2018 at 6:36 am
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      Hail to Rian !!

      lol i am sorry

  • January 19, 2018 at 1:38 pm
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    I tottaly understand the reasoning. I don’t really see where the KoR could factor in ep. 8. And people keeo bitching about ir, but the, questions: Why the Knights of Ren didn’t aided Kylo in Takodana. Why the KoR did not come to save Starkiller Base?? Why? Why JJ Abhrams didn’t brought them in a present scene?

    And now, it is Rian’s fault? If in 7 the group is only features in a quick flashback scene, and in a line said by Snoke? And I see people screaming that they are soo relevant? But, where is their impact to the story?

    Given the state of the Galaxy, the war, in the end of VIII, we can presume that the KoR will come into play in IX. And with JJ in the helm, he can finally put the group to use. No problem here.

    • January 19, 2018 at 4:00 pm
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      So agree.

      The Knights of Ren were nothing more than a plot device, to drive the story forward, to connect the past with Rey’s destiny.

      An appearance in Episode VIII or IX will add nothing to the narrative.

      • January 19, 2018 at 4:10 pm
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        They probably will be featured in IX, I hope so, because Kylo is their leader. But it’s not a enormous “must have”.

        • January 19, 2018 at 4:31 pm
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          They’ll only go out like chumps. So, fuelling further the “[Insert current SW directer] is a hack” narrative.

  • January 19, 2018 at 3:59 pm
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    What if Ep IX opens with “General Leia has died! A brutal attack by the Knights of Ren on the last remnant of the old Rebels heroes has set the remaing supporters of the Resistance in shock… etc.”

    Then the movie opens with a scene showing the aftermath of the attack. A shadow figure steps aside (possibly a Knight of Ren) to reveal Leia’s dead body (make it a sculpt, don’t show her face)…

    • January 19, 2018 at 4:25 pm
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      I don’t think we need to see her body. That… feels wrong to me. Disrespectful to Carrie. Maybe a funeral or casket type of thing. Like her peacefully laying there. Still I feel a body of any kind on screen seems… tasteless to me.

      A memorial, sad word said and/or mention in the crawl seems about right to me.

      • January 19, 2018 at 5:56 pm
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        I see your point. I can imagine it opening with a funeral. I just find it cool to set up the story with the Knights of Ren f***ing s*** up. Having them appear on screen in the very first scene would create some urgency and get the plot rolling from the get go.

        I still think though that Leia’s death should be used as the catalyst that sets up the story of IX. Igt can be the reason for the Resistance and their allies to unify together and as a trigger to set up conflict in kylo Ren that will ultimately destroy him

        • January 19, 2018 at 6:08 pm
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          Oh you can certainly use her death as a catalyst of some sort. Having the KOR open up with action is fine too. It’s just people have a wide reaction to how we treat death. Peter Cushing started a debate and his character was alive. Portraying an actor who’s passed… as a character who’s passed seems too on the nose. Especially troubling if it was a murdered character.

        • January 20, 2018 at 6:33 am
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          i think it’s for that JJ is coming back. To clean the mess left by RJ. i ve nothing against him and i think is a good filmmaker but he had a bit too much freedom imo

    • January 19, 2018 at 7:08 pm
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      I want them to recast Leia. Pay tribute to Carrie by giving her character the complete story arc. So many ways they could do it tastefully.

    • January 20, 2018 at 1:21 am
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      Kill Leia off screen in the opening crawl and then show Leia again as a Force Ghost in the last scene smiling and at Rey.

    • January 20, 2018 at 1:21 am
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      Kill Leia off screen in the opening crawl and then show Leia again as a Force Ghost in the last scene smiling and at Rey.

  • January 19, 2018 at 5:22 pm
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    It feels like there is no direction to this so-called trilogy.

  • January 19, 2018 at 5:22 pm
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    It feels like there is no direction to this so-called trilogy.

    • January 19, 2018 at 5:52 pm
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      The OT didn’t have any direction either. It’s just the Star Wars way of doing things.

      • January 19, 2018 at 6:52 pm
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        Episode 8 directly undermines the story of episode 7. The OT did not have this problem.

        • January 19, 2018 at 8:30 pm
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          Precisely, TLJ is basically a full on ASSAULT on all story threads set up by TFA. I’ve never seen anything like this in my entire life.

          • January 22, 2018 at 9:10 am
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            lol “a full on ASSAULT” “I’ve never seen anything like this in my entire life.”

            holy shit

          • January 22, 2018 at 9:10 am
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            lol “a full on ASSAULT” “I’ve never seen anything like this in my entire life.”

            holy shit

        • January 20, 2018 at 12:09 am
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          TESB literally rewrote the meaning behind key interactions in ANH (Obi-Wan/”Darth”, Luke/Leia, Obi-Wan/Luke), as did ROTJ. To say otherwise in an attempt to discredit TLJ is frankly ridiculous.

          • January 20, 2018 at 3:59 am
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            ESB built upon the things from ANH. Episode 8 directly contradicts or undermines all of the important plot threads of 7.

            The main driving point of 7 was that Luke was hiding from Snoke but left a map so the rebels could find him in an emergency. But in episode 8 we are supposed to forget about that and pretend Luke didn’t want to be found. Forget about the map g-guys nothing to see here!

            In episode 7 Snoke is built up to be the main villain but forget about that too, we changed our minds.

            In episode 7 we see that Rey remembers her parents leaving her on Jakku and flying away in a ship, but forget about that mystery we set up, actually they were hobos who died on Jakku and I guess Rey hallucinated that memory.

            In episode 7 Kylo is leader of the Knights of Ren, but forget about that, we can’t fit them into our bloated movie anymore.

            I could go on but the point is, episode 7 is now effectively rendered completely pointless.

          • January 20, 2018 at 7:22 pm
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            Who ever said he left the map in the first place? They never explained that he left the map on purpose, not speaking of wanting to be found.

            And even if he left the two pieces on purpose. He can still say no and judge the situation on the spot, which he did.

            And then all your other arguments are basically just things you made up for yourself what you wanted this movie to be. But obviously the movie didn’t give you that but surprised you. And instead of being happy to be surprised you basically just want something predictable and on the nose, more or less replicating what came before. How boring!

        • January 22, 2018 at 9:08 am
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          It doesn’t undermine anything. It just wasn’t what you expected.

          • January 22, 2018 at 4:42 pm
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            I had no expectations other than that they would continue the story of episode 7, which they didn’t do. Episode 8 is a reboot of the trilogy.

    • January 19, 2018 at 6:49 pm
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      Thats because there isnt…it is a fact.

  • January 19, 2018 at 5:44 pm
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    meh…I’d be happy at this point if we had no more stories on here about TLJ. As a matter of fact, spice it up with EU articles, Old republic stuff…anything else besides these movies that have split fandom at least for a bit!

    • January 20, 2018 at 1:12 pm
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      let the past die …, hahahahahahaha

  • January 19, 2018 at 6:48 pm
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    Rian Johnson is a hack…..you know a movie is trash when you read at least 20 articles with the headline ” RIAN JOHNSON EXPLAINS WHY THIS HAPPENED” ” RIAN JOHNSON EXPLAINS WHY THAT HAPPENED” ” RIAN JOHNSON EXPLAINS WHY HE DECIDED TO DO THIS” ” RIAN JOHNSON EXPLAINS ……………………

    • January 19, 2018 at 7:01 pm
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      Incidentally, I was watching TFA again today and got even angrier at how RJ completely ruined it with TLJ,

      • January 19, 2018 at 7:05 pm
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        TFA’s setup was super weak. JJ was a really bad choice to oversee the Trilogy. Should have been George.

        • January 19, 2018 at 8:09 pm
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          TFA’s setup was brilliant.

          • January 19, 2018 at 9:23 pm
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            I disagree. They made Kylo a whiney brat that killed his dad for no good reason. TLJ actually fixed this the only way I think it could. Trouble was it messed with Luke’s character.

    • January 19, 2018 at 9:58 pm
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      Oh dont worry man, after 20 more Rian interviews and 5 novels, the Movie will totally make sense LOL

    • January 25, 2018 at 6:18 pm
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      So because the Internet is full of clickbait, that makes the movie trash?

      Got it, bro.

  • January 19, 2018 at 8:49 pm
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    I live and breath Star Wars, but the amount of hatred and toxicity that has infected this community is extremely off-putting. It’s sad to see so many people react so immaturely and tear down this wonderful franchise.

    • January 19, 2018 at 9:49 pm
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      It was sad to see Rian Johnson write so immaturely and tear down this wonderful franchise

      • January 19, 2018 at 9:58 pm
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        While I disagree with that statement, people who feel that way do not have the right to be so hateful and nasty towards the director and other fans who like the movie (not saying you’re doing that).

        • January 19, 2018 at 10:02 pm
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          No I”m not hateful toward any fans, no. But I do despise Rian Johnson for his vandalism of the trilogy and characters.

        • January 19, 2018 at 10:02 pm
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          No I”m not hateful toward any fans, no. But I do despise Rian Johnson for his vandalism of the trilogy and characters.

          • January 19, 2018 at 10:27 pm
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            Hey that’s fair, that’s how you feel. I just think a lot of angry fans are doing more damage by expressing their frustrations in an inappropriate manner as opposed to being upset but still having some decency.

          • January 19, 2018 at 11:51 pm
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            I’m with Kent, if you love TLJ more power to you. For me, I thought the prequels were weak but I always had the OT and subsequently R1 and TFA. Sadly Rian has kind of tainted all these movies in my eyes.

          • January 19, 2018 at 11:58 pm
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            I understand fans who don’t like movie and have legit gripes with it. I think that really sucks because I wish there was a movie everyone loves but that’s not reality. My point however, is I wish more people would communicate their frustrations the way you and Kent are, as opposed to creating to the name-calling, hatred, and toxicity I see being spread around.

          • January 19, 2018 at 11:58 pm
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            Same here, I have nothing against my pals who like TLJ. Fortunately, only 1 or 2 of my pals liked it 😉

            I too LOVED: OT, TFA, R1 — but TLJ was vandalism.

          • January 20, 2018 at 3:36 pm
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            kent, I understand your point, but don’t you think the reaction is been too extreme by the people dissapointed with the movie? I like it without consider it the best movie ever of course. And I understand some people doesn’t like it… but that hate? is not a bit exagerate? I’m reading some comments by some people that even scary me!

          • January 20, 2018 at 1:59 pm
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            Are you twelve?

      • January 20, 2018 at 7:23 am
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        Here’s a mature statement for you then: If the Knights of Ren are left under wraps until Episode IX, wihout any bearing on the story or at least indirect link to what’s happening, we as an audience simply stop caring. Let’s be honest here: how many anong us forgot about those Knight dudes while watching TLJ? And don’t even get me started on Poe or Finn. What a wonderful waste!

    • January 20, 2018 at 1:18 pm
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      sorry, the true fans are raising their voices, and being heard.
      No more hackneyed BS from now on.

      Its sad that so many people who claim to be fans support this trainwreck,

      • January 20, 2018 at 4:18 pm
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        This is my point. Attempting to divide the fan base by claiming only “real” fans disliked the movie is only hurting Star Wars going forward. There’s better ways to voice criticism

      • January 20, 2018 at 4:18 pm
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        This is my point. Attempting to divide the fan base by claiming only “real” fans disliked the movie is only hurting Star Wars going forward. There’s better ways to voice criticism

  • January 19, 2018 at 9:16 pm
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    So you have nothing. As expected. A lot of trolling and little substance.

  • January 19, 2018 at 9:18 pm
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    Another order of nothing with a side of nothing.

  • January 19, 2018 at 9:27 pm
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    Maybe sometime between the lightsaber flashback and the start TFA, Kylo killed all the other KoR, at the request of Snoke or to curry his favour? It really doesn’t really matter. They were not important to this story in any way shape or form, and would not have enhanced the theme “Failure is the best teacher” in any way, so it’s good they didn’t show up at all.

    If they need to be shoehorned into IX, then start a First Order civil war, with Kylo, backed by the Knights of Ren and a ragtag group of stormtroopers and officer true believers against Hux, backed by a surviving but damaged Phasma and a discipled and well-equipped FO military. I’m still working on how to fit Rey and The Resistance into this. Maybe they ignore the civil war until Kylo wins then swoop in? Just looking for a new and interesting place to take the story.

  • January 19, 2018 at 11:43 pm
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    Oh yeah, those guys, right… what ever happened to them? If only we knew… Oh frack it who cares.

    • January 20, 2018 at 12:09 am
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      Summary of Rian’s entire attitude while making TLJ

      • January 20, 2018 at 6:22 am
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        Or just too much confidence.

      • January 20, 2018 at 6:22 am
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        Or just too much confidence.

  • January 20, 2018 at 7:48 am
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    Rian Johnson has used a line similar to this a few times when discussing issues people have had with this movie.

    I get that you don’t want to clutter a million things into a movie and cause it to run so long that it loses the audience.

    -Snokes backstory (in any capacity, even just 2 minutes of dialogue of his history)
    -Knights of Ren

    Two things that were built up only to be left out by Rian in his installment. I know I couldn’t do a better job than him, but I do feel like a better job could have been done. Continuity is so important to a series, and when you don’t answer questions raised in previous movies, it feels lazy.

    Seeing as how Kylo Ren is a HUGE character in the movie, they could have cut down on other scenes to make room for the Knights of Ren. I would have been okay without most of Canto Bight.

    • January 20, 2018 at 1:56 pm
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      Omg. Remember the line by Obi Wan about The Clone Wars in Theben original Star Wars? Dis they answer it in the OT? Nope!! It was a throwaway line. Similar can be said to the Knights of Ren. Although i wanna see them appear, I can see why someone’s would leave them out.

      AND just one thing I wanna say to all the people complaining about questions not being answered. We still have one move left, yo! Chill!

      • January 21, 2018 at 4:10 am
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        Get what you’re saying but still have to slightly disagree.

        Obi Wan mentioning the clone wars was a throwaway line, yes. Lucas didn’t market the clone wars as important back then though. The Disney marketing machine hyped up Snoke and the knights of Ren. Had JJ directed TLJ, I would be surprised if he threw those details away as Rian did. We’ll never know though.

        As far as people complaining about the movie, it didn’t live up to some fans expectations. That’s fine. It didn’t live up to mine, and I certainly don’t feel bad about admitting that. I have no problem with people who did like it though.

        • January 21, 2018 at 4:40 pm
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          Wait a sec. When did Disney market Snoke and the Knights of Ren? We don’t have any books, nor comics about them whatsoever.
          I also haven’t seen a single Snoke action figure in the TFA days. The only one I have seen appeared recently before TLJ as part of the Black Series.

          The Knights of Ren have no action figures either + they don’t even appear in the Star Wars visual dictionary. We don’t know anything about them. We don’t even have a clear picture as how they actually look in detail. The only thing we have so far is the blury image from TFA + two concept drawings on the internet.
          Neither Snoke nor the Knights Of Ren have appeared in any marketing material, in contrast to Captain Phasma f. ex.

          But this is the problem with your theory. People have blown these characters out of proportion against Disney’s intend and now feel like Lucasfilm owes them something…

          • January 22, 2018 at 9:06 pm
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            You’re right about Snoke not even having an action figure, so you got me there. BUT, Andy Serkis and JJ described him as a mysterious shadowy figure who had been around since before the events of the OT. The Knights of Ren were mentioned in more than one novel, and it’s eluded that they’re tied to Kylo REN more than once. Why even create the group if you don’t use it?

            My point isn’t that you need to describe every single detail to make a rich story. Snoke, at the very least was a pretty big deal, and you can’t tell me that giving details of his backstory wouldn’t have enriched the story further. Same with the Knights of Ren. Kylo Ren – Knights of Ren. Obviously they had a decent enough impact on Ben Solo. JJ built some pretty interesting characters in TFA , and I just feel like it was a missed opportunity by Rian.

            The very fact that Snoke has somehow taken control of the first order, trained Kylo Ren and is has some sort of past interaction with Luke, Leia, and Han makes him a pretty hyped up character without all the pomp.

            Is this movie perfect? No. Is any movie perfect? Absolutely not. Rian Johnson had his reasons for doing things the way he did. While I don’t hate him or wish any Ill will or a number of other ridiculous things people have been saying, I felt like he did an okay job at best. I don’t feel that Lucasfilm owes me anything. That doesn’t mean I have to love every decision they make. Some fans (the ones calling for Johnson’s Head and stating that this movie should be removed from canon) certainly come off as entitled or at the very least, immature. I don’t think stating things one doesn’t like and giving reason for it falls into the same category though.

            With almost any other movie, no one would point towards books or comics or visual dictionaries as proof that characters mentioned in films aren’t “important.” Most films don’t get the “Expanded Universe” that Star Wars does. Why? Because Star Wars fans eat the universe building and backstory given to people, places, events, etc. right up.

            I’m assuming you enjoyed the movie, that’s fine. Given that we have two different opinions about the film over all, we’ll just keep going in circles over this and I suppose we’ll just have to agree to disagree.

            For the record, you’re one of the few who supported your side of the argument without getting nasty. That’s admirable, considering the recent climate on this website.

  • January 20, 2018 at 7:54 am
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    If the Last Jedi was a good film, as some here allege, none of the scenes would require an explanation.

    Rian’s just doing damage control, nothing more, nothing less.

    • January 20, 2018 at 11:21 am
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      I think he is doing interviews, answering questions, and those answers are being reported – it is normal. It is not damage control. Those that disliked the movie still dislike it, those that enjoyed it still enjoy it. I do not see many fence sitters that might be swayed.

      As someone who enjoyed the movie it is nice to hear his explanations about his reasoning for choosing different elements.

    • January 20, 2018 at 3:30 pm
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      I’m sorry but I’m absolutely not agree with that. I like the movie and I understood everything. But I do think he shouldn’t give explanations just because fans complain about the movie. It is pointless, he did what he did and for me its fine, for others won’t be, but he doesn’t need to justify it to anyone. Said that, there is a lot of movies with scenes that need explanations or a few rewatch and at least to me are amazing movies, like Christopher Nolan movies.

    • January 20, 2018 at 5:31 pm
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      And they don’t. I understood them fine as did many others. But we have a lot of morons in the fandom.

    • January 20, 2018 at 7:51 pm
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      I had no problem understanding all the debated scenes. Would I have done them differently? Probably. But I had no trouble understanding what Rian Johnson did. I liked the movie over all. Heck… I’ll go see it a third time today, just for you.

  • January 20, 2018 at 4:15 pm
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    As far as I can agree with some critics towards this movie: overreactions towards it come from people who doesn’t accept one of the main rules in life is the need to take risks in order to move forward. The fact that they come here in a daily basis spitting the same message all over again it’s quite a good example of it. Guys from 20 days now we’ve moved to a new year. The movie came out almost 40 days ago. Let’s move forward before boredom kills us.

    • January 21, 2018 at 12:41 am
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      You underestimate SW fans. The hate of Prequels still shadow the internet for 15 years now

  • January 21, 2018 at 5:11 pm
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    Truth be told. I actually forgot the Knights of Ren even existed. : /

    I figured that like Phasma, they’d just be relegated to focus in expanded material. Because I have a feeling they would serve very little beyond glorified ‘fodder’ in the films.
    Heck, I’m imagining Johnson would have just done something akin to having them all appear on the horizon. You know, looking all bad-ass and sinister…And then a large object would fall on top of them.

    Because well, trolling the audience seems very much TLJ’s modus operandi. In that whatever you’re initially expecting to happen, won’t happen.

  • January 23, 2018 at 8:27 pm
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    “We have a very full movie already there literally was just not room for another element…”

    pure chicken shit.

    • January 23, 2018 at 10:08 pm
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      Nah. You didn’t get fanwank, wah wah

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