SPECULATION: Darth Plagueis Revisited.


Back in May we published an article speculating whether or not Darth Plagueis could be a potential villain for the Sequel Trilogy. Since that article was released it has sparked a lot of debate and discussion within the StarWars 7 News Blog and Cantina community. In a bit of a departure we’re publishing an article by a member of The Cantina Forum who goes by the handle  “Joe12Hawk” who has done some excellent research that supports the original Darth Plagueis article. Keep in mind I have only edited the article otherwise the piece is original by Joe12Hawk. So without further ado I present the first guest article — Darth Plagueis Revisited . . .



Could Darth Plagueis be the Sequel Trilogy’s main villain? This is a follow-up of the Darth Plagueis story from a few months ago on this site.



James Luceno had a Question and Answer with TheForce.net Facebook page fans and had this to say when he referenced to the beginning of his novel “Darth Plagueis” which is listed under “Legends” but may just hold the key to what happens in the Sequel Trilogy.

Q: What sparked the idea to begin the book with the scene of the death of Plagueis? Were you trying to connect fans at once to the only part of his story that we’ve heard?


A: I felt that I had to deal with that proverbial elephant in the room. The surprise, if we can call it that, had to be the when rather than the how.

The Ancient FearWe find the answer to Luceno’s proverbial elephant later in the book . . .

As Plagueis expired, his apprentice experienced a monumental disturbance in the Force, which he interpreted as a shift that anointed him the sole agent of the dark side. But he also experienced a sensation of sadness and loss in the Force. Sidious initially feared that the cause of this unease was a sign that his master’s experiments had succeeded after all, that Plagueis’ spirit had somehow survived earthly destruction, and would return at any moment to exact vengeance on his treacherous apprentice. However, after learning of Darth Maul’s apparent death at the hands of Obi-Wan Kenobi on Naboo, Sidious dismissed his concerns, deciding that this was the true cause of the feeling of loss he experienced.


This leads me to a quote from George Lucas in the ’80’s referencing what the Sequel Trilogy will be about. One plot point of the sequel trilogy that has been incorrectly reported for years derives from a 1980 interview with George Lucas in Bantha Tracks. Lucas was asked what the third Star Wars trilogy was about and he said that “It deals with the character that survives Star Wars III and his adventures.” This quote has led to speculation that a character from the prequel trilogy would be frozen at the end of Episode III, hibernate through the Galactic Civil War & be revived for Episode VII. This leads as well to two set of quotes. One from Revenge of the Sith, Darth Sidious while converting Anakin in his office:

Sidious: “To cheat death is the power only one has achieved but, if we work together I know we can discover the secret.”


And then Yoda to Luke in Return of the Jedi before Yoda passes away:

Luke: Master Yoda, you can’t die.


Yoda: Strong am I with the Force . . . but, not that strong.



Could the discovery of immortality, especially by a Sith, be what has been rumored “The Ancient Fear?” I believe the first quote refers to how Sidious suspects that Plagueis cheated death and needs Vader’s help to discover the secret if he in fact did because in Attack of the Clones it is made clear that the Jedi are having an even more difficult time seeing the truth, the complex machinations of evil, because of how the dark side is clouding their vision. Yoda makes this clear to Palpatine/Sidious at the beginning of the film. Maybe Sidious suspects that there’s something more going on? But it should also be noted that the same fault that allowed Palpatine/Sidious to implement his long waiting plan — that of arrogance or the complacency of dominance — ironically was the same fault that led to his demise as we’re told by Luke Skywalker, “Your over confidence is your weakness.”


In the last season of The Clone Wars: The Lost Missions there’s an episode dealing with the Banking Clan and how they have secret accounts. It’s made clear that neither of these accounts belong to the Republic or Separatists because the Banking Clan supported both sides. Could Sidious have suspected this and thought it was his old master’s accounts?


The second set of quotes I speculate upon refers to how Yoda may have found out that Plagueis did manage to become strong enough with the Force to cheat death. How could he have found this out?


SPOILERS ahead for those who’ve yet to see Season 6. In the last season of The Clone Wars, Yoda learns of Order 66 and other things through a journey with the Force, through the guidance of . . . Qui-Gon Jinn. Perhaps Qui-Gon communicated with Yoda through the Force. This could explain why it was so important that Luke pass on what he knew because, Yoda knew what was coming and this could end things. Here’s the last scene from The Clone Wars. It leads you to believe Yoda learned things on his journey and may feel there is more to learn:



I referenced earlier how the Darth Plagueis book is listed under “Legends,” but it should be noted that according to Wookieepedia the episodes of The Clone Wars that reference the Banking Clan’s secret account are listed under the Legends Banking Clan page as well even though Disney said they were canon. Disney & Lucasfilm has a big say on what is printed on the site. “It is a fan built version of the Holocron, a database maintained by Lucasfilm to track everything in the Star Wars universe and ensure continuity within it,” according to Wikipedia. There’s also the mention of a Sith Urn under the Legends page, but should be pointed out that the Urn containing Plagueis’ ashes is seen in Revenge of the Sith, if only briefly. Jennifer Heddle of Lucasfilm had this to say about the Plagueis novel, “The story is ‘Legends’ but remember the character Darth Plagueis is mentioned in ROTS and therefore canon.” And at another point discussed the old EU by saying, “It’s all non-canon, but it all exists as a resource that could be used down the line.”


One more curious clue that can’t be overlooked is Starwars.com’s own Database which has absolutely NO reference of the Muun — Plagueis’ species — or Scipo, home of the Banking Clan. It does mention the Banking Clan, but only in accordance to Attack of the Clones and NOT in The Clone Wars, but displays a Clone Wars image. A bit odd . . .


So, what’s in the novel that could be included in the Sequel Trilogy?


1. Plagueis gave Sifo Dyas the resources to fund the Clone Army.


2. We are led to believe that Plagueis created a being with the Force, one with a higher midi-chlorian count then any known Jedi . . . Anakin Skywalker.


3. Destroy the Rule of Two.


Among other things these are the most important things.



The fair question is, Where would Plagueis have been during the Original Trilogy? Why didn’t he come back sooner if he is indeed alive? I speculate that he was off building his own Sith legion because he knew the Empire would fall and when the time was right he’d return to have his revenge and destroy the New Republic with no Jedi Order to protect it thus taking over the galaxy. Heavy lifting done thanks to Darths Sidious and Vader.


As so . . .

“You must begin by gaining power over yourself; then another; then a group, an order, a world, a species, a group of species . . . finally, the galaxy itself.” – Darth Plagueis


Yourself = Plagueis

Another = Palpatine

A Group = Banking Clan

An Order = Jedi Order through Sifo Dyas

A World = Kamino

A Species and a group of = Kaminoans


Galaxy itself, returning when the time is right to have your vengeance.


+ posts

143 thoughts on “SPECULATION: Darth Plagueis Revisited.

  • November 14, 2014 at 7:13 pm

    It would be cool to have an alien Sith mastermind.

    Since beings are merely catalysts for the force, perhaps a creature with a more exotic biological makeup would wield the dark side differently than a human (Palpatine.)

    • November 15, 2014 at 1:25 am

      Kind of like Ki Adi Mundi’s binary brain which probably gave him some extra force sensitivity or awareness.

    • November 15, 2014 at 8:57 am

      Plagueis coming in the new series will be fantastic. It will be new for SW fans and everyone as no one has seen him b4. A muun Plagueis would be the coolest thing to see eva! Hope JJ takes note of this. Bane will not appeal as much as Plagueis. Plagueis has a gravity to his character.

      • November 16, 2014 at 1:22 am

        Not to mention being ‘alive’ thoughout the entire three trilogies, patiently waiting, makes it all the more ominous.

    • November 21, 2014 at 3:30 pm

      That would be a great idea. Seeing such different sith on the screen would be definitely refreshing and interesting.

  • November 14, 2014 at 7:19 pm

    I’ve not read the Plagueis book or comics or anything about him in fact.. What species is he? Duro?

    • November 14, 2014 at 7:23 pm

      He is a Muun

    • November 14, 2014 at 7:25 pm


    • November 14, 2014 at 7:28 pm

      As the article states, Muun.

    • November 14, 2014 at 7:38 pm

      He’s a MUNN Dasweallycool.

  • November 14, 2014 at 7:33 pm

    Thanks for sharing my story, guys. A couple of updates since I wrote this.

    StarWars.com deleted their Banking Clan page on their Database. Bit odd ..

    Also another quote. Luke tells Sidious in Episode VI, “Your overconfidence is your weakness. ” …. Could his overconfidence come from thinking he killed Plagueis? I can’t think of any time he truly loss in the Prequels …

    • November 14, 2014 at 11:20 pm

      Remember those handful of people that luck guessed the Ep7 title years ago? Well,…some guy on a message board back in Nov ’14 figured out…

    • November 15, 2014 at 2:54 am

      There actually are references to Plagueis in the Databank. They’re in the biography photo gallery within the Palpatine page.

    • November 15, 2014 at 8:16 pm

      Palpatine killed Plagieus in his sleep to become the Sith master, hence the rule of two. There can only be two, and master and an apprentice.

      • November 17, 2014 at 9:12 pm

        But isn’t that incredibly simplistic? Considering the billions of beings in the Galaxy, there can only be two who inhabit the dark side at any given time?

  • November 14, 2014 at 7:35 pm

    Remember in a radio interview with James Luceno he said that he belived George Lucas had quite alot of things to say with the Darth Plageuis novel as he heard from people that he gave poimnters to the story etc when LUCASFILM gave James Luceno facts etc,as Sidious was a mayor character to GL.And the fact that LUCASFILM arrogance now say this novel is bullshit as that is going against the word oh GL himself, clearly they are just ignorant like Filoni is when he said Dooku came up with the money for Seperatist movement dumbing it down.ALSO GL said himself Plageuis is a Munn so thats canon.

    • November 15, 2014 at 1:11 am

      Lucas empowered them to do as they pleased when he sold the company to Disney. You want to bitch about somebody? Bitch about him.

    • November 15, 2014 at 1:45 am

      LOLZ… Lucas contradicted himself constantly, and was too stubborn to admit it. How Filoni ever got involved with SW is beyond me… these Cartoon series’ he makes are godawful… the other animated clone wars cartoon on the other hand… that was bad ass.

  • November 14, 2014 at 7:37 pm

    hes a muun

  • November 14, 2014 at 7:38 pm

    “It deals with the character that survives Star Wars III and his adventures.”

    I believe “III” just meant ROTJ at the time. While he talks about Empire being Episode 5 in the interview, he had just referred to “the third film in this trilogy” in the last question and his answer to what the next trilogy was about was a character that survives Star Wars 3 (not Episode 3). I think he was just referring to Luke without giving away the fact that he survives ROTJ.
    I seriously doubt he had Plagueis as a character at the time, and Plagueis didn’t “survive” ep3 anyway as he wasn’t a character in it. Notice he says “his adventures.” That isn’t the kind of language he would use if he was talking about the bad guy.
    Another way to look at it, if it is talking about ep3, is as a reference to Luke’s sister (not Leia at the time, but someone who was at the other end of the Galaxy). Lucas said before he cut it down to six films that Luke would finish with Vader in ep6 and go off to find his sister in ep7, train her, and they would fight the Emperor in the last two.

    • November 15, 2014 at 12:15 am

      Very good point. Though that could have changed to fit a villain. Example of this, George in his original treatments for the Prequels said C-3PO would be created by a kid in a junkyard. He changed it to the kid being Anakin.

      I don’t think it will be exactly like how he said it in the 80’s but, will come close.

      • November 15, 2014 at 4:36 pm

        That’s a very big stretch though. I see no reason to think it has anything to do with Plagueis then or now. That doesn’t mean Plagueis couldn’t return in some way, but I just don’t see this as evidence. And I still don’t believe that Plagueis will return as a spirit a la Obi-Wan as George has said several times pretty recently that the Sith are incapable of it as it is a purely Light side ability that represents selfless sacrifice. Though you could get around it by saying he latched on to someone like a parasite and must stay attached to a body or he will go into the void.

  • November 14, 2014 at 7:39 pm

    I think this is a very logical choice for a villain as Star Wars is very much about the legacy of the Skywalker family. “He could even influence the midichlorians to create life”- Darth Sidious. I think by bringing in Plagueis they could bring the entire Skywalker story full circle and even have a “I am your father” moment when it is revealed that Plagueis is the one responsible for the birth of Anakin.

    • November 14, 2014 at 8:37 pm

      “I am your granpa…”

      Poor look, wbat a reality to deal with..?

    • November 14, 2014 at 9:16 pm

      Agreed best way to take it and could tidy up the prequel aswell as they left a lot up n the air about how anakin came to be and whether the skywalkers are destined to turn to the dark side due to there heritage

      • November 15, 2014 at 1:45 am

        “He could even influence the midichlorians to create life.” I will go a bit further to say that “create life” could mean to ‘bring back to life.’ Why would Palpatine tempt Anakin with this kind of logic unless he was implying that not only can he”save people from death” but he could actually create life(Frankenstein concept). Anakin lost his mother and Qui-Gon and I’m sure the idea may have crossed his mind to bring them into fruition again. Only in the ‘good side’ have we seen that this can this happen but only as a consequence or reaction to the ‘Dark Side’ Alchemy that Plagueis and Sidious were honing. I think that allowed the ‘Good Side’ of the force to balance using Yoda and Obi Wan to retain their identities. Jedi Force ghosts achieved immortality. Lets see if the Sith also did in the ST.

      • November 15, 2014 at 1:48 am

        UGH NO. Have you ever seen a movie called “Return of the Jedi”? Luke resisted the emperor… he won’t turn to the dark side no matter what.

  • November 14, 2014 at 7:54 pm

    An excellent article, Joe12Hawk!

    One thing that I’ve been wondering about, though, and you brought this up in the article so I figured I’d ask you about it.

    When I read the Darth Plagueis book, I got the distinct impression that rather than Anakin having been created by Plagueis through his experiments, Anakin was instead created by the Force itself as a reaction to the work that Plagueis was doing in sort of an “equal but opposite reaction” sense.

    Did I misread that? (It’s entirely possible that I did.)

    When the end came for Plagueis and Paplatine felt that uncomfortable tremor in the Force, I took it to mean that Palpatine was feeling the unexpected “wild card” wrinkle in the Sith’s plans that was the spontaneous creation of Anakin by the Force.

    Again, I’m not positive that I read the bits about Anakin correctly, but it really seemed to me that his birth was something completely separate from Plagueis’ experiments.

    • November 14, 2014 at 8:21 pm

      The Force itself creating Anakin always seemed silly to me. If the Force is conscious like that, why not just remove the power from the Sith and be done with it?

      • November 14, 2014 at 8:54 pm

        In may have been more like a reflexive action when Plagueis and Sidious messed with it.

        • November 15, 2014 at 4:30 am

          I like the idea of Luke just being an ordinary person who got involved in a much larger story and, with the help of his friends, saved the galaxy from the Empire.

          Now he’s the son of Space Jesus. And he’ll probably be uber powerful in VII. -_-

          • November 16, 2014 at 11:53 pm

            He was always the “Son of the Suns” in Lucas’s scripts.

      • November 14, 2014 at 8:55 pm

        Where is the money to be made in that?

        • November 15, 2014 at 4:31 am

          Why not have a story that’s engaging without sounding so silly? Now the Force is a person who willfully creates beings to fight the Sith? ^_-

      • November 14, 2014 at 9:17 pm

        This fan should actually try reading the novel again. Darth Plagueis did NOT create Anakin Skywalker. The Force did it to counterbalance Plagueis’ horrible unnatural acts of attempting to create life through his Frankenstein-like experiments.

        This is what happens when you get a fan to write articles on this site. Please don’t do it again.

        • November 14, 2014 at 9:28 pm

          Thank you! Much appreciated. 🙂

        • November 16, 2014 at 11:57 pm

          Actually, the book isn’t canon, so we really only have what Lucas hinted at in EP3, i.e. Plagueis was able to create life and that life was Anakin.

      • November 14, 2014 at 9:41 pm

        Where’d your imagination get stunted at?

        • November 15, 2014 at 4:33 am

          I have an imagination, but that doesn’t mean I’m going to swallow everything that comes down to me from Star Wars.

    • November 14, 2014 at 9:27 pm

      Thanks I appreciate the kind words and question. Not sure how to explain it myself. http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Grand_Experiment

      Here’s how Wookieepedia describes it from book. Maybe he didn’t create Anakin but, he thinks he did and that leads to our young heros in Episode VII looking for the true answers after a reveal of sorts.

    • November 14, 2014 at 9:39 pm

      in reply to dekka 129 I read the same thing. Plagueis did not create Anakin. Anakin was created by the force.

      • November 15, 2014 at 1:38 am

        I doubt JJ wants to continue on that path with TFA – virgin birth, that is; too divisive and controversial.

      • November 15, 2014 at 4:40 am

        Did the Force plan to have Anakin become a slave, violently lose his mother or turn to the dark side?

        Was it part of the Force’s plan to have Anakin help wipe out the Jedi Order and apprentice himself to the very person he was created to kill in the first place?

        If not, why didn’t the Force create another individual directly from itself (virgin birth) to handle Vader and the Emperor? Why did the Force need to create someone using a virgin when it easily could’ve used a regular Jedi or Force sensitive to do the job?


        You see, this is why I find this whole “the Force created Anakin” utterly ridiculous.

  • November 14, 2014 at 8:41 pm

    Remove the power from the sith? Because what is light, without the dark? It’s about balance (yin and yang)… As a quote I read, you can only see the stars while in darkness.

    • November 14, 2014 at 8:58 pm

      From what Lucas has said, balance isn’t about half Jedi-half Sith, but the Sith themselves are a symptom of imbalance. It is about balance within, not of opposite forces on the field. With balance, there would be no Sith as there would be a balance within the Jedi and the Universe as a whole.
      Genocide and totalitarian rule isn’t a sign of balance, but of imbalance. But those things are what the Sith do when they have power. When the Jedi lose their focus and become arrogant and rigid in their ways (imbalanced), this allows the Sith to manifest.

    • November 15, 2014 at 4:44 am

      That’s like saying evil is necessary for good to exist. Why fight evil when we need it?

      • November 18, 2014 at 1:37 am

        Yea, I never liked the idea of “good and evil have to be balanced.” Didn’t ever make sense to me. It makes more sense that the evil is the imbalance.

  • November 14, 2014 at 9:22 pm

    I agree with Tim Snow. Disney is using every propaganda trick in the marketing book to remind fans that Star Wars is just three films and not the full six (which is really unfair if you like the PT like me.) The bad guy in VII will be either a new creation or someone from the OT who is suddenly repackaged to seem “relevent” to the overall story. i never believed the “count dooku relative is adam driver” rumor because many OT diehards didn’t like count dooku. simple as that.

    Also, shame on this fan for claiming that Darth Plagueis created Anakin. Please re-read th novel.

    • November 14, 2014 at 9:58 pm

      I disagree with this statement. If you have been watching Star Wars Rebels it is very clear they are not forgetting the Clone Wars. There are CW/PT vehicles seen all the time in the show. Including a AOTC clone helmet on a shelf in the beginning of the episode Empire Day.

  • November 14, 2014 at 9:22 pm

    Wow. That’s the force acting. I just finished to watch Episode III. Remembering the Morpheus quote:

    “When I see three objectives, three captains and three ships, I don’t see coincidence, I see providence.”

    Anyway… this week I watched the Prequel Trilogy and it has pretty good movies. The Episode I problem, I agree, it’s Jar Jar and his clumsiness. The Episode II it’s a good movie and the final battle makes it’s frickin’ awesome.

    And the Episode III it’s wonderful, emotional and beautiful. The movie is good, despite one or two lines of dialog that are bad.

    And here I go to Plagueis. Would be great to see him in the upcoming trilogy. He knew how to cheat death, perhaps he did some thing and is living out there in some deserted planet just waiting to show himself to the Galaxy. What if he’s been hiding in Had Abbadon? That’s the planet we see in that conceptual art that can be seen in the site’s banner.

  • November 14, 2014 at 9:31 pm

    I highly think it is Plagueis that is the Main Villian and that he will fullfill the return of the Sith. Two thing would have happened at death. One he swapped his body with a custom clone of himself with horey jaw and breath mask right before Sidious electrocuted the clone to death. He would have been on a starship immediately after the swap leaving behind a replica to fool Sidious.
    The most likely however is that he did Kill Plagueis and Sidious had him entombed on Moriban as per the Siths wishes. He then when the Force Awakens returns to life like a Zombie or a Mummy. Clearly needing a new undead apprentice (Adam Driver). Either way he survives.
    **** Most important is the concept Art which clearly shows the Muun holding a Red Light Saber and Adam Driver at his feet. You can see he is Tall, wearing Body Armour, his face is mangleded and he even has his trusty breath mask. How people who know the character ahve failed to see it is him (not to be mixed up with the GraveDigger) is baffling to me. Max Von Sydow even looks like Plagueis. He made Annakin and is the sole surviving Sith. I personally think he swapped out his body last second with an exact duplicate or he knew that he would be resurrected. Either way prepare to See Zombie Plagueis at a theater near you.

    • November 14, 2014 at 10:26 pm

      I can dig it… would be a cool way to wrap the pt, ot and st all together while keeping Luke the golden boy who ends the dark times once and for all.

  • November 14, 2014 at 9:53 pm

    I can’t wait until the characters are revealed so people would finally shut up about Plagueis & “the ancient fear”. Plegueis looks stupid, I doubt JJ would make him the main villain (which I think we’ve already seen in that leaked concept art).

    • November 15, 2014 at 12:36 am

      I can’t wait until you see that Darth Plagueis is the only villian that can be tied with all the SW movies.

      • November 15, 2014 at 1:13 am

        Hey the Prequels called… they want their stupid inconsistency back again. But JJ said no. LOLZ.

      • November 15, 2014 at 1:24 am

        I don’t want to see that PT hogshit tied with the new films.

      • November 15, 2014 at 3:54 am

        “I can’t wait until you see that Darth Plagueis is the only villian that can be tied with all the SW movies.”

        And why’s that? Only because some fans were gullible enough to buy Sidious’ tale about Plagueis’ talent to “create life”?

        I mean, seriously now, can there really be folk in real life MORE naïve and gullible than Anakin was in the film?

        Reality check for you, anon friend: Palpatine was lying through his teeth, only to get Anakin on his side.

        This is what evil masterminds do, you know? They cheat, and they steal, and they LIE. They obviously don’t rise to top by being the most upfront, honest folk around.

        • November 15, 2014 at 6:37 am

          Then wait…and you will see…Darth Plagueis has the real SW villian…not only linkef to the PT but with the OT movies too…and it is amazing, trust me.

          • November 15, 2014 at 6:53 am

            Sorry, but unlike most of you, poor naïve fools, I CAN tell a liar when I see one lol!

          • November 15, 2014 at 10:17 am

            And I can see here a comic-gamer fan specting to see Revan, Bane or another big and muscular bad sith villian (comic style)…but let me tell you…this is cinema…not comics or video games…so…good luck and keep dreaming 🙂

          • November 15, 2014 at 11:49 pm

            Must be the mirror you’re looking into, anon. Because I spoke of the INNER workings of an evil mastermind, not his brawn or even his supernatural abilities, for that matter.

            But, hey, if you were gullible enough to take Palpy’s BS as true Sith gospel, I guess it’s only natural that you’d miss my point completely lol!

          • November 17, 2014 at 5:14 pm

            You’re going feel very stupid if it is him. Of course you wouldnt admit to it…thats just how you are.

  • November 14, 2014 at 10:10 pm

    Sorry, but he looks like crap. Your average audience will not dig this character in the slightest.

    • November 17, 2014 at 12:05 am

      We don’t know what he looks like. He hasn’t been shown in canon.

  • November 14, 2014 at 11:04 pm

    I too would like to think Plagueis plays a role even though he may or may not be a Muun anymore. But another thing to remember is the Mizzlewump rumor. Most of the list so far appears to be true and the villain is listed as being Darth Ruin and his apprentice/ancestor. Ruin predates even Darth Bane in the current line of Sith if the old EU timeline holds.

    Our main villain is likely an all CGI creation. We have no hints pointing us to who the actor maybe as all Daniel Craig, Cumberbatch and similar rumors have been all debunked as quickly as they arose and then there’s the Adam Driver contradictions which have presented themselves in various forms over the past year.

    • November 14, 2014 at 11:25 pm

      L O L Z!!!

      I love people who are in complete denial. Oh hey 2013 called… they told me to tell you that they want their EU back!

  • November 14, 2014 at 11:46 pm

    It can only be him as the main villain. Anything less would just be less than sidious and that woud be less of a villain. It’s got to be an even bigger villain than sidious for this trilogy to work.
    It all makes perfect sense and everything can be tied in really well

    • November 15, 2014 at 1:27 am

      I don’t like the simple “bigger equals better” mentality.

      I don’t want the new villain to keep topping the last one. I want someone who’s memorable and different.

  • November 14, 2014 at 11:57 pm

    Newsflash… Plagueis wasn’t bigger than Sidious… he got his ass kicked by Sidious… otherwise Sidious wouldn’t have become the next sith lord! Please lets move on with all this ancient fear nonsense. No more EU clutter. No more Prequel clutter… JJ’s in town & he’s gonna clean up shop 🙂

  • November 15, 2014 at 12:00 am

    I haven’t read so many news about Episode 7 plot or possible charatcer’s description so this question probably has been made before or it’s silly. Just came to my mind today.
    Sorry if someone has said that but what if Max Von Sydow charatcer is Syfo Dyas?
    Someone thinks could be posible?
    If you tell me to wake up i will understand ;P

  • November 15, 2014 at 12:06 am

    He got beat by sidious? Or was it all his master plan?
    It’s not EU stuff. I’m talking about the plagueis spoken about in Episode 3.

    • November 15, 2014 at 12:12 am

      A story that might have been partially fabricated to sway Anakin to the dark side?

  • November 15, 2014 at 12:07 am

    Wasn’t Syfo Dyas like a code name for Sidious? I thought that was implied in Episode II since the Jedi order were unaware of the Clone Army’s existence or Dyas.

    • November 15, 2014 at 1:24 am

      He was a Jedi. Watch the sixth season of TCW

      • November 15, 2014 at 1:29 am

        I could only manage to endure 3 and a half seasons… it’s soooo bad. The other clone wars cartoon was like 80x better… that one’s actually fun to watch.

        • November 15, 2014 at 3:24 am

          season 6!

        • November 15, 2014 at 3:53 am

          Despite I like the Cartoon series I prefer the 3D one, It’s far better than the old one. So many people love 3D series and 99% of people did not like to see the series being canceled.

    • November 15, 2014 at 1:29 am

      “Syfo Dyas” –> “of SyDyas” o_0

    • November 15, 2014 at 6:39 am

      Doug Chaing said in an art of star wars book, it is like an anagram Sy (foe) Dyas.
      Add the word Foe ( as in bad guy) into insidious you get Syfo Dyas.
      It is the foe in sidious, in other words.
      But Obi Wan asked who he was and it was said that he died 10 years earlier.
      And what about the missing twenty one…can you name them all?
      Dooku was one.
      Was Palpatine one…obviously not if their busts are all there.
      Lucas Set up another trilogy for who ever wanted to buy it.
      There is another is a set up for Rotj
      But the Tragedy of Darth Plagius was defiantly a set up for another trilogy.
      Syfo was a go buy this EU book pathway or Another potetial Lucas set up. Plot hole or was it insidious himself who ordered clones?
      But what did Mace say about Syfo when Kenobi asked?…that he died.
      Did Dooku wipe the Jedi archives before leaving the order?
      Was Jasta Nu a Sith witch?…that I doubt.
      Either a mega ton of plot holes, poor writing, or sequal set ups.

  • November 15, 2014 at 12:10 am

    So far the main villain has been rumoured/reported to be..
    -Adam Driver
    -Resurrected Palpatine
    -Luke Skywalker
    -Darth Plagueis
    Keeping my tongue in my cheek with this stuff..

    • November 15, 2014 at 2:31 am

      Or a brand new Villain, that is always possible too.

      • November 15, 2014 at 4:23 am

        Darth Spanking.

        • November 17, 2014 at 1:52 pm

          He’s hot on your cheeks and isn’t afraid to be beaten, for he loves a thrashing?

  • November 15, 2014 at 12:15 am

    “Wasn’t Syfo Dyas like a code name for Sidious?”
    I don’t know. It’s one of those things from PT that still drive me crazy.
    If i remember well they say Syfo Dias was killed by Dooku or something like that. But it remains uncertain for me. I supouse i will have to watch PT trilogy again 😉

    • November 17, 2014 at 12:14 am

      It is answered in the 6th season of Clone Wars. He was a Jedi who saw the war coming and was manipulated by his friend Dooku into secretly ordering the Clone Army so they would be ready when the time came. Dooku’s final test was to kill his friend on Sidious’s orders.
      It was clear in EP2 that it wasn’t a code name for Sidious as Obi-Wan knew he was an actual Jedi that died 10 years before. I believe the name is similar because he was originally going to be Sidious (under the name Sido-Dias), but Lucas changed the spelling and made him an actual Jedi.

  • November 15, 2014 at 12:17 am

    When you think about it, Darth Plagueis had to be the villain.
    For this film not to just be tacked on but rather a continuation of the Skywalker story certain things need to happen.

    The story always had to be about The Balance of the Force but it also had to re-imagine the Skywalker story (Not just be the tragedy of Darth Vader). And that means going back to its origins. (It also has to bridge all three trilogies).

    The story of Plagueis links to the very creation of Anakin. In a way, he (and perhaps Sidious) was Anakin’s father.
    I’ve wondered whether his/their manipulation of the Force to create Anakin was part of what put the Force out of balance in the first place.

    If this is the case and Plagueis still has the power to create ultimate Force users, cheat death himself and save others from death then he really would be the ultimate threat. This perhaps leads to these questions:
    – Is the Skywalker family line tainted by the unnatural power that created it?
    – If this kind of unnatural power Plagueis has puts the Force out of balance then would that not awaken the Force?
    – Has Plagueis been behind the scenes and actually been THE puppeteer all along?
    – Sidious ‘tells us’ that he killed Plagueis in his sleep. It’s a long shot but could this also link to the ‘Awakens’ title?

    For me it links the trilogies, fleshes out the Skywalker story and adds relevance to VII-IX. No better way to round it off by the Skywalker family finally learning where they came from and then facing off against the ultimate evil and power to bring lasting peace and balance.

    It could also be the thing that drives Luke ‘mad’. After looking into his past, he believes his future is tainted. Coupled with his great power, his concerns over his own state of mind lead him further and further into darkness. But the new heroes bring him back into the light and show him that he is in control of his own destiny.

    So in terms of Luke I think the story will be that sometime after the events of Episode VI, Luke started to have visions about his past and present. He was unsure of what it all meant.

    He started to look into his past and discovered some dark things – how his father was created by evil.

    With his increasing power and uncertain of his own intentions Luke becomes a recluse on the Sith world of Moraband – where his father’s conception took place.
    His visions worsen and he begins to see the return of ‘Darth Vader’ both masked and as a deformed man. Burning villages, laying waste to cities etc.
    He wrongly believes this could be his own future.

    I believe this ‘Darth Vader’ will turn out to be Adam Driver’s future instead.
    At the end of the movie Driver will suffer a horrendous injury and be ”saved’ by Plagueis and become his apprentice.
    He will wear the Darth Vader suit from then on (there is no way Disney wouldn’t have Darth Vader in a Star Wars film).
    Before this happens, Han Solo will be killed (either by Luke or his own son) but not before asking Luke to redeem his son like Luke did his father.

    Luke will then train Kira and with the help of Boyega’s character and maybe Serkis/Gleeson, the 3 new central protagonists will seek to bring peace to the Galaxy.

    P.s. I think it possible that the backdrop to the story will be that the Galaxy has been in a state of ‘Cold War’ for many years. The Empire will have been awaiting its chance to strike once again and VII opens at the beginning of that attack. I think the tone of the movie could very much be a mysterious cold war type thriller mixed with the classic Star Wars western space adventure. Boyega could be a spy who discovers something grave about the Empire (and perhaps Plagueis’ plan) and seeks to find Luke Skywalker. He first comes across Kira (ahem) and then they set off together to find Luke – the only person who can stop the Sith. The other villains could be the old Sith Inquisitors or just dark force user types who serve the Empire.

    • November 15, 2014 at 12:21 am

      I would love to see this movie you are talking about, the story is so perfect. You should be doing the script!!!!!

      • November 15, 2014 at 12:31 am

        Probably he worked in TFA and he gives us, without we even knowing, the real argument of the film

        • November 15, 2014 at 1:11 am

          Oh god don’t make me puke… Thankfully everything from all these EU-ish or Prequel-ish rumor mills has gradually been debunked. But for whatever reason you guys keep insisting that these movies should be as boring & predicable as Filoni’s cartoons.

          Can’t wait to see JJ & Kasdan show you guys what a real Star Wars movie should be look like 🙂

          • November 15, 2014 at 3:59 am

            Wow, Anonymous, that is an AMAZING plot and I should know (I’m a writer in real life). 🙂 I would totally read your books/watch movies with a script you wrote. You’re making me slightly envious.

      • November 17, 2014 at 5:59 pm

        Despite your “feelings” to the contrary. This is the most sensible story line theory I’ve read yet.

    • November 15, 2014 at 1:32 am

      I think the ST will be looking forward much more than backwards. And I don’t think it’ll stop at IX.

      • November 15, 2014 at 1:52 am

        Agreed. & I wonder if Lucas’s 80’s outlines did extend to XII? It seems like the idea of it going that far was bounced back & forth. If there was an outline for all XII I’d be very happy about that. I don’t think 9 movies is enough for a vision this grand 🙂

      • November 15, 2014 at 2:00 am

        How do you know where to go if you don’t know where you are coming from? The Past,Present and Future are all but concentric circles that form an intersection of central awareness. Such are the ways of the FORCE.

          • November 15, 2014 at 2:27 am

            The beauty of Star Wars is that its a very elastic story. It can transform and correct itself amidst contradiction. I think it thrives on contradiction. Much like the concepts of Free Will and Predestination, The Chicken or the Egg, Creationism vs Evolution. etc.

          • November 15, 2014 at 4:27 am

            S-t–a—r W-a–r—s!

          • November 15, 2014 at 4:50 am

            Anon @ 2:27 AM:

            GTFOH with that asstalk.

    • November 15, 2014 at 2:22 am

      You seem to be putting some pieces together but you’re mistaken about Anakin. He is the ‘Chosen One’ you must see it. He was conceived by the Midichlorians. Only few know that Anakin turned to Vader. A secret that perhaps if revealed will create a serious chasm and identity crisis in the Skywalker bloodline.

    • November 15, 2014 at 3:56 am

      I agree with most of your story arc with the Skywalker saga coming full circle. Based on some of the recent character descriptions of Luke in this film, I’d go further to wonder if Luke’s meditations in the force did a similar force shift that resulted in the creation of Anakin but in this case may have resulted in “Kira’s” birth. “Kira’s” birth via the force may be what causes Plagueis to awaken and begin to plan a confrontation with his new adversary, Luke.

      I also like the idea of having force users throughout this film in the form of Order 66 survivors who may have turned to the dark side and others who were in hiding. This could explain the lightsaber Kira finds in the scrap yard.

      To reference a recent article posted on this site, if we were to compare “Kira” to Ania Solo, she would come into conflict with former Jedi A’Sharad Hett who survived the Clone Wars. A’Sharad Hett, like Anakin, was from Tatooine but is the child of a Jedi Knight and a Tusken Raider. In one storyline from the Clone Wars graphic novels, Hett comes into conflict with Anakin who flashes back to his mother’s death at the sight of Hett’s Tusken headwear. Hett later becomes Darth Krayt on Koriban under the tutelage of Dark Lord XoXaan who looks a whole lot like the pictures of the witches who were leaked back in April.

    • November 15, 2014 at 11:09 am

      Learn to speak English you fucking spastic.

    • November 15, 2014 at 10:30 pm

      Don’t buy the ‘Luke driven to madness’ story. More likely it’s Luke driven to despair by a devastating personal tragedy. And, according to Disney, the sequels will have three young leads – one male and two female.

  • November 15, 2014 at 12:56 am

    Just imagine if the one Andy Serkis is playing is Plagueis… *Goosebumps*

      • November 15, 2014 at 5:47 am

        Jar Jar gave me gunganbumps. No cream or ointment has given me any satisfaction.

      • November 17, 2014 at 12:05 am

        No, I hated Jar Jar because he was a ridiculous character that didn’t fit in with the story and was simply put in for cheap laughs. Something he utterly failed at. I didn’t hate him just because he was CG, which you seem to be implying is the reason he sucked. I don’t know what exactly you were thinking but comparing the work Serkis has done within CG to Jar Jar is simply insulting.

  • November 15, 2014 at 1:29 am

    Though he might be a Munn in the books…could they not change the look of the Munn or change the banking clan to some degree. I do understand that SW Clone Wars Cartoon is canon but how about DARTH PLAGEIUS being a MUNN? Why does that really matter in the overall story? I kind of wish they would draw from the hidden sith ideas in many of the EU novels…that he has been hiding in the outer reaches of the Empire and waiting for his time to strike. This would allow for a great disturbance that couldn’t be felt by Luke or anyone else. Perhaps the Empire has bardered a deal with the Sith Emperor who has been growing his strength with a group of Mandalorian warriors (Bobba’s look but different backstory Gwendoline wearing this as the Mandalore leader).

  • November 15, 2014 at 2:23 am

    Darth Plagueis has been in front of us all the time. He is hidden in one of the original characters 🙂

  • November 15, 2014 at 2:27 am

    Yup it’s the stay puft marshmallow man…

  • November 15, 2014 at 2:49 am

    What complete nonsense.

  • November 15, 2014 at 3:20 am

    I never read the book but I loved palpatine’s story in ROTS and how maaaaaybe it linked to Anakin. I’d love for Plagueis to be the villain.

    Maybe this is the dark side of the force that’s awakened perhaps by Adam Driver’s rumored interest in Sith relics. Maybe he collects one too many and bam Plagueis!

  • November 15, 2014 at 4:51 am

    Will they dare to mention or reference midi-chlorians in these new films?

  • November 15, 2014 at 5:39 am

    I just remember the Dark Horse comic series, where Palpatine returned in the body of a clone, and tried to make luke his apprentice once again. He had a similar back story to plaugiuse, claiming to be around long before Vader, with centuries of apprentices… Is that just completely removed from the mythos now?

    • November 15, 2014 at 6:54 am

      I always remember reading Palpatine was around for over a thousand years, and that was just bad ass.

      • November 16, 2014 at 11:29 am

        Badass or bad ass?

  • November 15, 2014 at 6:38 am

    A lot of fans (Including myself) were saying that is the Emperor were the main villain they would be extremely disappointed but this post about Darth Plagueis being the potential villain made me think. Darth Sidious was obviously overconfident and power hungry to a fault. When he shared that scene in Revenge of the Sith with Anakin where he talked about the tragedy of Darth Plagueis the Wise he looked like the satisfaction he took out of it was a weakness. From reading the book I got the impression that Darth Plagueis was a Sith Lord who wouldn’t let unecesssary personal satisfaction cloud his judgement. Part of it could be the whole Muun /Banking Clan background and let’s be honest bankers only care about the bottom line. So what happens is Plagueis didn’t die and sat in waiting. Knowing all along that his apprentice would eventually be destroyed by Luke Skywalker AKA the greatest Jedi of all time and while in exile Plagueis grew stronger and started to build up the Sith again. According to rumors, Luke exiles himself because he’s growing insanely strong and is worried about turning to the dark side and hurting the ones he loves. Could it be Plagueis trying to infiltrate Lukes mind? According to the research above Plagueis could have been the one to have an influence in helping crest Luke so perhaps he has a mental bond. Last but not least Darth Sideous. The picture of The Grave Robber has been analyzed more than the Zabruder film. The one thing we can all agree on is that this Grave Robber has reverence for Darth Vader. So what if the Grave Robber is Sidious? Mace Windu shocked him with his own force power for a very long amount of time and when Anakin stepped in to save him he was able to rebound very quickly, even being able to force toss Windu like a strongman tossing a toddler. When you look at the final scene in Jedi, when Vader grabs the Emperor he’s only getting that force electricity for a fraction of the time that he did in ROTS. After he’s thrown down the shaft who’s to say he didn’t survive? Especially when his master’s forte is how to cheat death. The concept art features a man who is 90% robot and 10% man. He could be just a walking disaster held together by the dark side. Also, you look at the concept art and the robe and that one pic of him standing in what looks like a emperial ship could be an Easter egg. In this arc I see the emperor as a defeated man who thought he was the shit by defeating his master, only to be destroyed by his masters creation (Luke) and be made into a shell of himself while his master comes back stronger than ever, to use his former apprentice for whom he played like a fiddle to do his bidding in an attempt to get back in good graces. If it were up to me (What the fuck do I know) you treat Plagueis with the same lurking sinister tone as the emperor, have him lurking in the shadows and tease him but don’t reveal him until fully episode 9. Lastly look at the one thought title and the actual title. The title that some were speculating was “The Ancient Fear” if you look at potential Plagueis story line above that could not just apply to Plagueis but some explanation of how he escaped death. Then you look at the actual title “The Force Awakens”, and see that can imply to the dark side of the force that awakens in Plagueis. When the title dropped it was controversial, with a lot of people assuming it was generic for Star Wars coming back or the fact that Luke goes into exile but then returns but if they work in Plagueis it takes up a whole different meaning. Andy Serkis? Secret big actor (Voice)? I’m calling this! I am a diehard Star Wars fan so I apologize if this is really long but I will read anything if I feel it’s going somewhere so I guess I will know what everyone thinks by the comments

    • November 15, 2014 at 7:00 am

      Impressive log, sir.

    • November 15, 2014 at 7:00 am

      So are you implying in a round about way that Palpatine made Anakin into Vader as if to make his creation into the form of his mentor?

      • November 15, 2014 at 8:42 pm

        Not exactly. I always got the vibe that Plagueis never truly trusted Sidious but him teaching him the way to cheat death was for a purpose. Like he held out the final ingredient so Sidious could cheat death but lose a significant amount of his dark force powers as a result. Plagueis to me was the real Phantom Menace all along. Sitting in the shadows (literally) and letting the clone wars play out so when he made his return the Galaxy would be at war and it would be ripe for the taking. He wasn’t going to return in episodes 4-6 when Sidious was at the height of his power because that would have been an illogical move. Could he have been strong enough to defeat Sidious? Perhaps, but he probably knew that between his overconfidence and the presence of Luke who’s force levels were off the charts that it was only a matter of time before Sidious was defeated. Also, it’s no coincidence that his potential return comes when Luke’s power is at its peak but he is most vulnerable. As far as Sidious and Anakin I don’t think he had any intention of creating Darth Vader as a tribut to his mentor. I think he thought he had just seized control of the the greatest Jedi ever (He was wrong obviously) and through his hubris felt like he was powerful enough to control him and should Vader turn on him, he had the proverbial “Cheat Death” card in his back pocket. Sidious always knew that there was a little bit of Anakin left in Vader. A small bit of humanity that he viewed as weakness. It was that humanity that Sidious felt would give him the the power to control Vader through his emotions, but ironically, in the end it was that humanity that took him out

    • November 15, 2014 at 5:21 pm

      Good theory, but this is all too “done before”
      So our choices are Darth Bane, who looks like Sauron,
      Or Darth Plagieus who IS Sauron, but looks like Voldemort.
      Not sure how marketable it is.
      THAT SAID, they did manage to make the Villain of the original blockbuster defining trilogy an UGLY OLD GUY who talked like a sarcastic chain-smoker.
      So who knows? Definitely not poster material though, he needs a non-Vader-non-Greivous puppet to do his bidding and look cool for the trailer.

      • November 16, 2014 at 1:06 am

        Darth Bane is too batman in my book and reminds me of Entertainment Wrestling.

        • November 16, 2014 at 11:27 am

          You think Darth Bane is too Batman now? Wait ’til he dons his black stormtrooper helmet and puffyass coat.

  • November 15, 2014 at 8:35 am

    Whereas I like the Plagueis character, I feel that the average movie goer will experience some confusion if he is revealed as the ST’s villain…”What the heck is Voldemort doing in Star Wars?! Luke, that lightsaber is useless against such a foe! Expelliarmus! Expelliarmus!”

  • November 15, 2014 at 3:54 pm

    Not that agree with this but wasn’t word on the street that the prequel trilogy will be completely forgotten about for the next trilogy as if it never happened? Because JJ was worried about receiving the same reception george did when he released the prequels as opposed to how well received the originals were?
    So isn’t Plagueis on refrenced in ep 3 (besides the book about him) so wouldn’t that mean that this new movie would have to acknowledge ep3 if they were to use the character?
    I for one think the idea is fantastic and the thought of not refrencing any of ep 1-3 or ‘pretending they never happened’ actually really annoys me as a fan who loved the originals and also embraced the prequels and enjoyed them too. Not only would I like to see the story follow on from ep 6, I would also like it to tie in nicely with the prequels aswell. Having a story about Plagieus is a great way on doing that I feel.

    • November 16, 2014 at 11:26 am

      Fuck the Prequels. They turned me sour against Star Wars outside the OT. Thank goodness Disney is in charge now.

      • November 17, 2014 at 11:20 am

        You suck

    • November 17, 2014 at 12:24 am

      No one ever said that. They made it clear that the PT is canon and will stay that way. They ARE leaning on people’s love for the OT in the marketing (and for good reason). But that doesn’t mean the story itself won’t have ties to the PT. It was George’s outline for his sequels, and if they rely on something PT, I doubt J.J. or Kennedy would want to disrespect George like that (George entrusted his friend Kathleen Kennedy with his company because he knew she would safe guard it, after all). And I’m sure he would let people know that they changed a central plot element from his notes.

    • January 17, 2015 at 5:06 am

      The events of Episode VII take place 50+ years after the Prequels. Disney/JJ don’t have to pretend the Prequels don’t exist. In terms of storytelling, there’s just no necessity for them to specifically reference any of those events. Even the Sith Rule of Two and the Jedi forbidding marriage can be changed because both Orders essentially died and are starting up again, conceivably under new rules.

  • November 15, 2014 at 6:46 pm

    I hope there is absolutely no reference to the prequels. They should be forgotten like the Christmas Special.

  • November 16, 2014 at 1:23 am

    So basically, Pleigueis is Voldemort.

  • November 16, 2014 at 3:29 am

    If you Don’t refrence the prequels or ‘pretend they never existed’ then you really don’t have much to work with in the big scheme of things as really eps 4-6 didn’t really give us much information about Jedi & Sith full stop. Most of what we know we have really gathered from the prequel era. I mean without the prequels who the hell is the emperor really!? What do we know about him or how he came to be or what he really is exactly? People forget how little we all really knew about the Jedi before the prequels. (And yes I am excluding all EU because you can’t expect Joe average non Star Wars need to read all that just to understand the movies)

    • November 16, 2014 at 11:24 am

      Who cares? Just move FORWARD and give us something new.

  • November 16, 2014 at 3:56 am

    Shmi ” There was no father, I carried him I gave birth, I can’t explain what happened. There’s more to this story.Look at the way she looks at Qui Gon in this scene and the scene when Qui Gon gets the midi chlorian count from Obi Wan. Look at the look Shmi gives him. She knows more. ( Plagueis ? Does she know of him ?) I’m hoping so.

    • November 16, 2014 at 11:22 am

      Please. Shmi thinks she was impregnated by the Force. She doesn’t know what the fuck she’s talking about.

      • November 17, 2014 at 12:18 am

        She was either impregnated by the Force or Plagueis messing with it. Sorry if you don’t like it, but it is canon and they won’t change George’s vision.

  • November 17, 2014 at 3:38 am

    No, thereisanother … who must end it.
    “The Force is strong in my family. I have it, my father has it, and my sister has it.”
    Yes… It is time for Leia to carry the torch.

    • November 17, 2014 at 3:49 am

      No, thereisanother … who must end it.
      “The Force is strong in my family. I have it, my father has it, and my sister has it.”
      Yes… It is time for Leia to carry the torch.

  • December 8, 2014 at 9:38 pm

    Darth Plagueis as the villain?


  • January 17, 2015 at 4:48 am

    This is a sequel to Return of the Jedi, not Revenge of the Sith. Disney isn’t doing anything to remove themselves from the prequels, they’re just setting up the frame of reference necessary for their new movie.

Comments are closed.